Remember love at 16 - what you thought it was, what it was for you? Remember your thought processes about it and how wonderful and awful it could feel?

What about now? What do you think love is now? How do the two compare? What have you learned?

I've learned a bunch. I'm sure you have too. I'd like to hear your thoughts.

Interesting. My first love in high school broke up with me at the beginning of our senior year because he wanted to date a sophomore who was willing to chase him more than I was. It just about broke my heart at the time, but I eventually I forgot him. I met him again at one of our class reunions, when he told me his wife had just divorced him and admitted he'd never been good at relationships. Gee, ya think? LOL

My husband of 36 years isn't perfect, but he's always worked at our marriage as hard as I did. I imagine if I'd stayed with my high school seewtheart, I'd probably be divorced now, too.

For me, love at 16 meant trying to be whoever or whatever the guy wanted me to be. But after a night of making out, they'd say I like yo as a friend!!!
Love at 46 means, this is who I am, if ya don't love me, find someone else!!!

Ah- love at 16- thank God for unanswered prayers!

Yes, GOOD point, Pattyann!!!

Amen Pattyann. My first love was a ladie's man. Phew. I am so glad that didn't last. But boy was I head over heels in love with him at the time, and crushed when he dumped me because I wasn't willing to run the bases with him. Remember that?

I married the love of life. By the grace of God, our love grows stronger all the time. I have learned that a good marriage takes work by both partners. Fortunately, my husband puts just as much work into our relationship as I do.

We just spent the night at a harbor hotel this week for our one night get-a-way Christmas date. I highly recommend it. It was total bliss!

Also have to mention that it has been fun watching my kids fall in and out of love. Not always fun, sometimes agonizing. It brings back the feelings and memories of the teen years all over again.

I wasn't allowed to date until I was 16, so the boy I "fell in love with" didn't happen until I was 17 or 18. We went into the Marines, and made plans to get married when we were both home on leave.

Whew! I'm glad I realized what a mistake I was making and broke it off.

I wasn't "in love" with him, I was "in love" with being in love.

I was married twice before I figured out what falling in love really meant. My husband and I will be married 8 years this January. He truly is my best friend and makes me happier than I've ever been. He is the man I can picture myself growing old with.

ah-hem. I mean older with. :-)

OK,


I've got a question for you all.

I have a friend who is very lovely, and wonderful.

She has been living with her boyfriend for about 3 years. They are happilly co-habitating. She would like to get married - he has said that he is available too...they've been talking about buying a house together.

All of a sudden, he is making noises like, "why should we get married?"...

She is torn about what to do. To stay or to go.
Should she just be happy they have a great relationship and just keep on as before?

I asked her if there are any other issues.....she said "no"...then told me how he is going out with the guys alot more as of late.
hmmmmmmm. I think his single friends are discouraging him from tying the knot.

In fact, a mutual friend of theirs (a guy) gave her the line "you two are the happiest couple I know...why ruin it". (I'm like, riiighhht, that is coming from a guy!)

Any insight ladies?

danita

Danita- it sounds like your friends' man is going out with someone other than the "boys".If after all this time when things were good he gets antsy at forever I'd get suspicious
Dotsie you are sooo right about the joy and pain of watching our kids fall in love.When they choose people that give you that"oh-oh" feeling it's hard to let them learn if they get hurt
I found the love of my life my second marriage round and I learned that if you can find someone who doesn't ask you to give up yourself- it's real love

I was thinking the same thing.

I fell madly in love when I was 16 and gave my virginity to a very shy, quite, loving young man of 19.
It was his first time, but I didn't know it at the time.
He came back into my life via email about 20 months ago.
I'm now wondering if I was right to start writing to him.
It's a work in progress.
Lynne

I had my first real love at 17 instead of 16. That's when Brad and I started dating. And we've been together ever since!

I was 18 not 16 when I had my first "love" experience.....and a couple of years later we got married. It lasted 17 years and had a lot of ups and downs that's for sure. I remarried in my late 30s and have been married this time around for 15 years; falling in love in my late 30s was such a different feeling - I knew who I was, what I wanted and expected, and most of all what to really look for in a husband!

I really thought I knew it all when I was 18 - and I realize now I just had no clue.

Danita, I've been where your friend's sweetheart is - at least on some levels. After two bad marriages, when I fell in love the next time, both he and I decided why mess it up by getting married. I loved him. He loved me. We were committed to each other. That's what's important, at least to me. Then he died suddenly, so I don't know what we would have done had he lived. But I really don't think we would have married.

I grew up near a small town in western Oregon. When I was 16 I went to L.A. with my brother's wife to stay with her family for a couple of weeks. There, I met Leon. He had soft eyes and wavy dark hair. He played the guitar, sang ballads and was oh so sexy. I was in love. The music that was popular at the time was, "I can't get no satisfaction." Boy, was that predictive. After fruitlessly begging my parents to let me stay there for the summer, I came home. I pined for him. We wrote. He was drafted and went to Viet Nam. He asked me to marry him in a letter, and soon I was wearing his ring. When he got home a year later, I learned he had been living with a Vietnamese hooker while he was over there. (He and I never had sex.) I was crushed. I gave him back his ring.

At the time I bought into the idea that happily ever after was an automatic, if you were in love. I listened to all the love songs. I read love stories. I watched romantic movies. I KNEW what love was. Yeah, right. I, too, was in love with love. It was all fantasy.

Since then I learned the difference between daydream decisions, having the hots for someone and the real thing. I've learned that love includes respect, honor, consideration and compassion. I've realized that while passion can be important, if suddenly for whatever reason my husband and I can no longer engage in intimate activities, we will still love and be faithful to each other. He's proven this to me already by riding out my hot flashes with me when I can hardly tolerate being touched. I learned the value in being with someone who allows me to be myself, someone I allow to be himself. And I've learned the value of not saddling someone with "honey dos."

[ December 16, 2005, 06:57 PM: Message edited by: Vi ]

It seems like the real meaning of love eludes most of us when we are young. Some of you were blessed to get it right the first time around. The rest of us had to wallow in the mud for a while to figure it out. But the learning was good, wasn't it?

Pam, as I recall, your first marriage ended tragically. As you pulled yourself out of that, the lessons of love must have been very difficult.

I truly doubt what was felt at 16 was truly love even though to our young hearts it seemed we would just die if our feeling were not reciprecated. I was married at 18 and am not sure I knew what love really meant then either....My first husband passed awy after only three short years and it was during that difficult time in my life when I truly grew up brushed the make believe from my eyes and learned what true love really was and is still today...but before then I had some cripplng puppy love crushes going on and now my 15 year old grandson is having his firsr big crush, it is so cute to watch and enjoy it with him.

[ December 16, 2005, 08:42 PM: Message edited by: chatty lady ]

I have a little story too!

(you are saying, "right. A LITTLE story. Not from her....) But I'll try you guys...to ;make it short, I mean.

I was in 7th grade. He was in 8th. He was the new kid on the block, and I thought he was so cute...We began talking at recess. (still had those back in the day - even in 7th and 8th grade) And soon, my father was driving us to the bowling alley, and often to the Paramount Theater in Aurora. Picking us up hours later. (what a dad!!!). We went on this way for 4 years...Then I had the stupidist idea I have ever had in my entire life. At 17, it began to scare me that he would be the only one in my life for my entire life. We broke up....He cried and cried. My mother was mad at ME!!! This young man was the sweetest person, handsome, an athlete, smart, and would run from his house to mine in freezing weather along the railroad tracks for 3 miles, just to see me. He called me one night (he called EVERY night and we would talk for ever and ever - me under the covers in my bed, so my parents couldn't hear - they did anyway as my dad would say, "Jo!!! Your voice carries, I can hear every word you say! Knock it off and go to sleep!) (same dad that would come into my room in the morning and say "ROLL Out JO! Time to get crackin!!! ooohhhhh, how I hated that!!) to have me hear a new Christmas carol he had just heard....He just loved it and wanted to share it with me - "The Little Drummer Boy" Later, he went to Viet Nam. Our little town always had news about our soldiers in the front window of a store downtown....I always stopped at that window.

The last time I saw Dan, my Nichole was about 14 months old - he thought she was so cute....

Then when my mother died in 1989, Dan saw her obit in the paper and called me clear out in North Dakota - this was 16 years later. We have not stopped talking since. He has two wonderful boys by a marriage to a girl in my younger brother's class. They married about a year after I did. 1970. He now owns a couple or more of moving companies, (pretty large ones)and is still an athlete and a wonderful friend.

OOPS....BIG MISTAKE....BIG ONE!!!! Who says young love is foolish? I was foolish then and later!!!

Danita - I say - it isn't about whether they marry or not, but how they solve their conficts...Do they hit below the belt? Take cheap shots at one another? Or sit down, talk it out, and come to a reasonable conclusion? Would he run down railroad tracks for 3 miles in freezing weather? Would she? When he's down, can she bring him up? When she's down, can he bring her up? There's the test, I think.

when our oldest daughter was 16, she was a bouncy, happy go lucky honour roll student.
Then she fell 'in love' with a boy who came from a very difficult and troubled background.
And she became pregnant....

Three months after their little boy was born, they got married. And eventually through connections he got a good paying job and they had two more children, bought a house, car etc .. But they had some big difficulties to cope with because of other issues.

Then he had found a girlfriend ... and they split up. Our daughter was 22, with 3 small children, her life had to completely change again.

Nobody seen or heard from him until ten years later.

It was just after new year's, when our daughter had a phone call from one of her former in laws, saying that her former husband was in the hospital dying of pancreatic cancer.

Immediatedly she contacted him, and within the week had taken her children to meet their dad, ... she wanted healing between her two sons, daughter and their dad while there was still time. And deep hurts were healed....

Both these grandsons are excellent soccer players, i call the second one 'the dancer' when he is on the field. Through the workings of God, his soccer team had a rep. game to play, in the city where his father was in hospice care. Somebody bundled up his dad, got a wheelchair and took him to see his son dance and dance during that game. Six days later his father died....
It was our daughter who helped make his funeral arrangements....

At 16 this girl fell in love, which caused many heartaches and troubles .... on the other hand it also brought joy and an incrediable strengthening to all in our family....

[ December 17, 2005, 05:46 AM: Message edited by: norma ]

I don't have a story to add, but I couldn't resist saying to Norma that your daughter warms my heart. She is truly a wonderful person and I don't have to know her personally to make that statement. I admire her strength of character and the compassion and love she showed to this man. I know you must be very proud of her, and I bet her children are too. What a good heart!

JJ

thank you JJ... at the time of her former husband's death, she was living with another fellow, they had been together for five years, he was away taking a course ..

three nights before the death of her former husband, i went over to see how everthing was going..... she wouldn't turn around from washing dishes.... i said 'what's wrong, what's wrong ?'.. she turned around, tears pouring, she had just had a long distance phone call from her common law partner....

he had gotten married to someone he'd met while away.....

In more ways than these she has been through hell and back again... they each have ..

Speaking of these things, is like opening old wounds ... i'm not sure if i want to...

[ December 17, 2005, 02:12 PM: Message edited by: norma ]

Norma, your daughter went through so much at such an early age. Yet she showed amazing compassion and forgiveness for the father of her children. You taught her well.

Norma, your daughter sounds like a strong, compassion young woman. May her life hold only good things from now on.

Again Jackie and Bluebird, thank you for your words....

on a brighter note, under the same topic, i sure remember that at 16, until maybe in my late twenties, none of us ever used the word 'sex' outloud. "It" was referred to as "It".

Chatty Lady, it must have been terribly hard losing the one you loved when you were so young. Did he die in Vietnam?

The stories all of you are telling really touch me. So much heartache, foolishness of young love and yet all so growth producing.

Norma, my guess is that your daughter is destined/called to do something truly spectacular with her life. The things that have happened to her, as she processes them, will bring her beautufil soul to a place where she can contribute in a wonderful way, and many will be blessed by it.

Searcher, I keep thinking of the love you let go to experience others, and now regret doing that. I longed for a love like that when I was that age. It never happened. I guess I had things to learn from other people along the way. Had I found that kind of love early and stuck with it, I would have missed out on learning so many valuable, and yes painful things. I would not have become who I am now. And I like me now. So my guess is that it was not a mistake for you to turn away. You had other things to learn. Maybe next time you will be ready for that kind of love.

I was in love at 16 too. With the best looking guy in the world, but he went away to college. He wrote, but to me he was simply gone. I married someone else at 17. He came to the wedding and promised my new husband I would be his one day.

He stayed in contact and eventually married a girl who claimed to be pregnant with his child. He got in med school and I got divorced. He left his wife and child to marry me, but I married someone else and he cried.

The second husband was abusive and he traveled cross country several times to rescue me, never expecting more. I divorced the abusive husband and by then he was a multi-millionaire doctor with a plane that he flew to me. He was giving up everything he had worked for to get a divorce and marry me when I married my third husband.

Again, he stayed in contact. Eventually he discovered that the child he married for was not his, but he never told anyone except me and the boy's mother.

We were planning a class reunion when I came home one day to the news that he and his wife had both been killed in a plane crash. I was so sad. I couldn't stop crying and I wound up divorced again. I planned never to remarry.

The next Christmas Eve, the boy he raised who had a three year old daughter by then discovered the truth of his birth, went to the gravesite, called friends to pick him up, and shot himself in the stomach. Because it was Christmas Eve and the friends were delayed, the boy we had given up so much for bled to death on the grave of the only father he had ever known. He left his three year old daughter to deal with his death every Christmas for the rest of her life.

For a long time I was angry and all of that consumed me. But now it is in my heart, but not in my life. And I've discovered that there is love after loss.

smile

[ December 18, 2005, 04:34 PM: Message edited by: smilinize ]

Smile, your story brought tears to my eyes. The way you tell it is so beautiful. Thank you for sharing.

Fleeting love.... how sad.
Just want to hug you.... ((((HUG))))

Smile, what a sad and touching story. So you are okay now? You have love in your life now?

It really seems as we can learn so much from all this horrible stuff. Is your anger gone? It can take such a long time for the anger to go away. One of my problems was not acknowledging that I was angry. Anger was a sin when I was a kid, so of course I didn't believe I had any. I was wrong. I had been calling it something else, something that was not considered a sin.

Love to you. May your heart heal completely.

Vi thanks for asking but no he died when only 24, three years after we were married from nasal cancer. Thanks so much for asking.....

Danita there is a saying for your friend who's boyfriend doesn't want to get married: Why Buy The Cow When The Milks Free. Thats the reason I give my granddaughter about staying chaste until he/whoever buys the cow so to speak. My mother taught me that as well and it's true even more today....If she does decide to buy a home with this slug make sure her name is on the Mortgage and all other legal documents. Personally I would be ticked off at a man not loving me enough to make me his wife, whats that about????

LSmith5434, I don't remember if you're married or not and if so this is not a good idea. If your single and he's married this is not a good idea, get the picture???

Yep...I got it.
We're both married, if you want to call it that.
But I completely understand what you are saying.
That's why I'm cooling my heels on this.
I do appreciate you candor Chatty. It helps a lot.
Lynne

Chatty Lady,

How did you cope with your loss at such a young age? Did you nurse him while he was in decline? Did you have support? Or did you have to face it alone? I know that we all get through the awful things somehow, but when we are young, things seem so intolerable. It's hard to know at that age, that the pain will subside, and you will one day be whole.

Is this something you need or would like to talk about? I have an ear or two.

Vi

Vi, thanks. It was so very many years ago that time has managed to cover the wound. We just found out we were pregnant with our son three years into our marriage. He had been having terrible headaches and I made him go see our GP when I was at the OB/GYN, the same day. He had to go for more tests and yes I was always by his side. We decorated the nursery, had a huge baby shower togther even after we had gotten the frightening news. He was so brave and never lost faith but lost the battle. Back in those days the 50/60's they didn't have the treatments like they do today. Everytime I look at my handsome son I can see his father there looking back at me. I still become emotional when certain songs play like "At Last" by Edda James, it was our song. They say that what does not kill you, makes you stronger. Its true! We did have a wonderful loving hands on support system who helped us both so much and i never leftb his side....and my incredibly handsome and healthy, strong, honest, decent son, who is a caring husband and father himself now, honors his fathers memory everyday by his actions. I don't think one ever gets over such a tragedy and perhaps thats why I am so impatient with people who whine about 'nothing' and 'crab' about getting old. My husband would have been so happy for the priviledge to grow old. We are all so fortunate for that blessing....

[ December 18, 2005, 09:08 PM: Message edited by: chatty lady ]

Chatty Lady, as I read your words I pictured what you were saying, I felt it too because of my own losses. How difficult a period it must have been for you. How far you have come.

I understand about the whining thing. After my boyfriend died of cancer, I would get upset with my sister and her husband for snipping at each other, little digs like people do, even though they loved each other. I wanted to yell at them - tell them that at least they had each other. She's the one who died last summer. My brother-in-law now knows what it feels like.

These days when I see the snipping, I just think how much those people have to learn. And often to learn it we have to go through loss.

Does your dear husband come to you in your dreams? Do you or have you ever felt his presence? Those who truly love follow each other across eternity.

Love, Vi

Chatty, Your son is a tribute to his father and a tribute to you as well. In fact, you are a tribute to your marriage and your husband's love shines through you even now.

Loss is so hard, and love is not always easy either, but when memories are all that is left, the love makes them beautiful.

smile

[ December 19, 2005, 01:51 AM: Message edited by: smilinize ]

chatty and vi, I am sorry for your losses. Thanks for sharing. I'm grateful time manages to heal most wounds. You are both fine examples of carrying on in spite of loss.

Chatty and Vi, bless you for the strength and love you gave to your loved ones during their illness. I have lived with cancer both as a patient and a caregiver. Although we were fortunate enough to both survive, we also learned to face our own mortality. I, too, feel sad when I see others sniping at each other when life can be so short.

Our memories are what sustain us through both life and loss.

My first true love was my senior year of high school. We were both 17. We've been married for 38 years. Over the year that we have been married we have grown up together and now we are growing older together and if I had it all to do over again...I would pick this guy without a second thought.

Deb,how wonderful for you. I think most of us would have preferred to be wise enough to make those kinds of choices, or wished that tragedy hadn't taken the ones we love so. You are truly blessed.

Strength is a matter of enduring that which you think you can't stand and growing from it.

It wasn't wisdom that put us together. We were both just kids. I feel very lucky. With so many tragic things in my life my husband is my rock. I don't know what I would have done without him as I dealt with my father's Alzheimer's and my brother's suicide.

Deb, three cheers for wedded bliss.

I took my hubby to both my junior and senior proms, married at 21 and wouldn't trade a single day of our life together. We are still growing up together...

Dotsie you are one of the lucky ones, both of you are. I am certain that if Eddie would have lived we would still be together it was that kind of a relationship. Sometimes Vi I think I do feel him by my side and I am positive it is also the reason my second marriage wasn't a barn burner although it did last 14 years, I settled but that never works very long for either party. My third time around was the side affects from insanity caused by caring for a severe dementa patient 24/7 all by myself for 5 years, I was a basket case. He turned out to be a liar and a cad....oh well, live and learn.

Deb, you mentioned your father's Alzheimer's and your brother's suicide. How difficult for you. It is wonderful your husband was supportive during times such as those. Do you need to talk about either or both of these very difficult situations?

Dots, that's wonderful for you. Just wonderful.

Chatty, you're life has been very hard. May blessings find you from now on.

It seems to me that for some of us divorce is a rite of passage. I know I learned so much from mine. Tomorrow my third husband and I celebrate our 15th anniversary. I finally found a sweety.

Vi

Thanks for sharing all of your miles of experiences. I'm somewhere in the middle of everyone. I've had 26 years of a great relationship with a friend, lover and musical partner, which has turned into the last 6 years my being his caregiver as he goes through Alzheimers. Since we've had so many great years together, unlike those of you who lost your partners far too early, I am a willing caregiver through all the different changes that come with this role. I also find it a little difficult to listen to people's struggles with each other but I am also jealous that they have the luxury to be working stuff out.

Vi I guess it has in some ways, my first and best love died and then the second man I thought loved me and did for awhile began to change and then cheat and after 14 years we split up then after a short time he died too from (drugs & booze.) After 14 more years I gave my trust again and BAM another dissapointment from a cronic liar and user. I am now and have been single again for 6 years and never happier. No more men in my life except for colleagues and friends....too old to go through that again. There is nothing as sweet and pure as young love.

[ December 29, 2005, 09:11 PM: Message edited by: chatty lady ]