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#151054 - 06/12/08 10:41 PM
The Importance of Our Thoughts
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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I wanted to share this because I was surprised, though I shouldn't have been, by the "aha"-ness of it. Maybe someone else will benefit as well.
For quite awhile I've been finally feeling like I was on my way out of the worst of the grief. Still hard some days, but was actually feeling quite positive and okay overall. Then about two weeks ago, I began to spiral down. It was an unexpected and fast descent into very dark and negative thoughts. (I did call my therapist and had my first session with her yesterday).
I've been frustrated and confused by this sudden downward spiral, because I've been working diligently on staying positive, and have been faithfully journaling, praying and focusing on "what is", etc, etc.
Anyway, it's still too early to know if this is the answer, but it hit me today. Two weeks ago I bought a CD by Il Divo and have been listening to it constantly ever since...first thing in the morning, everytime I'm on the computer, last thing at night. I became especially fond of one of the songs, "Everytime I Look At You", and played it at least a dozen or more times a day. The music haunts me (pleasurably so) night and day. But today I realized that the same line has been playing over and over and over again in my head...day and night...perhaps even infiltrating into my dreams...the line is "Please, please turn out the lights."
To most people, this would mean nothing. But I realized today that, for me, it conjures up very negative images - ranging from symbolizing the final closing of Gary's eyes all the way to feeding the part of me that's always battled with suicidal thoughts. It had gotten to the point where every time I heard that line going through my head, which was ALL THE TIME, I would cry, sob in fact, at both Gary's death and the haunting thought that I have so wasted my life that it's not worth "keeping my light on".
I DON'T BELIEVE THAT...so don't anyone go getting worried here - I no longer even remotely consider that "turning out the lights" is an option - I LOVE BEING ALIVE...and as difficult as it might be at times, I LOVE BEING ON THIS JOURNEY! Sorry for the caps, but I just want to make sure everyone hears that!!
BUT, the point is that I realized that this line from this song IS and has been constantly feeding those sad images and dark thoughts into my brain.
Now that I know, I've stopped that line from playing in my head, and am replacing it with positive self-talk, like "Please, please embrace the light"...which has much more life-nurturing images and is already making a difference! (Princess Lenora, if you're reading this, your "light and love" signature has become one of my most powerful mantras...this new line leads me right into your "love and light", which always brings me peace and hope.)
Something as simple as this one line had such a critical impact on me, and my mangled thinking took that line and allowed it to lead me into a dark place where the lights were indeed being turned off. It really showed me once again how powerful our thoughts can be, and how important it is to stay aware of what we're saying to ourselves deep down underneath all the other noise.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151055 - 06/12/08 11:30 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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member
Registered: 07/06/06
Posts: 1521
Loc: Alabama
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Eagle,
You are so right...our thoughts are very powerful...even the ones that we are fully aware of...how awesome that you were able to figure out what was triggering your spiral...there's a saying something to the effect that it doesn't matter how many times you fall...it only matters how many times you get back up...I think we're really gettting in tune with ourselves when we can get back up so quickly!
Sending you light thoughts!
_________________________
Jane Carroll
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#151056 - 06/13/08 12:28 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Jane_Carroll]
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Member
Registered: 01/16/07
Posts: 3404
Loc: USA
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Eagle, How right you are! Thoughts are so powerful. I'll share a trick I have some day. I've only been using it a little over three weeks (when my therapist gave it to me to practice). It's working so far. I have a CD I use for the opposite... I use a song on it to lift me - ironically, on Eagle's wings - ...it's on a Michael Crawford's CD Here's a link to a rendition (not Crawford's) of it on You Tube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rRea9qnjK4&feature=related"But they that wait upon the Lord shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk and not faint." Isaiah 40:31
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#151057 - 06/13/08 12:45 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: gims]
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Member
Registered: 01/16/07
Posts: 3404
Loc: USA
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Where ya been Jane Carrol? More important, how are you?
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#151058 - 06/13/08 01:19 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: gims]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Gims, together with Psalm 91, Isaiah 40:31 is my favourite scripture passage; it's on my coffee cup. I love that song - we used to sing it in the choir I belonged to in Halifax. I followed that link to hear the song...started following other links and found John Michael Talbot there! He's one of my favourites! Now I'm listening to whatever I can find there of his. Do you know his music? Here's the one I'm listening to now: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-EqB91jNJ4&feature=relatedI have a lot of Christian music that I listen to. It's usually very uplifting and nurturing, But when I'm in that dark place, I even have to be careful with Christian music, because so much of it focuses on the yearning to go Home and, well, I can't go there! I have to focus on here-and-now and find/celebrate my life and meaning HERE on earth NOW. I have to constantly work hard to curb my yearning for Home so that it doesn't detour me too far from living fully the life I'm supposed to be living here.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151059 - 06/13/08 01:27 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Member
Registered: 01/16/07
Posts: 3404
Loc: USA
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Talbot is new to me and I'm enjoying listening. Makes me laugh! Quote:
I have a lot of Christian music that I listen to. It's usually very uplifting and nurturing, But when I'm in that dark place, I even have to be careful with Christian music, because so much of it focuses on the yearning to go Home and, well, I can't go there! I have to focus on here-and-now and find/celebrate my life and meaning HERE on earth NOW. I have to constantly work hard to curb my yearning for Home so that it doesn't detour me too far from living fully the life I'm supposed to be living here.
I hear you loud and clear. But, the darkness we live through is important so we can be in tuned with others who are hurting. And, our ability to overcome them is also important... I know you know this.
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#151061 - 06/13/08 07:13 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Member
Registered: 01/10/06
Posts: 992
Loc: Honolulu, Hawaii
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Eagle, I will be praying for you. Sometimes the grief process
takes longer than we want it to, and as time goes by you will find
yourself less and less in that dark space.
((((Hugs))))
_________________________
Cenn on FB
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#151062 - 06/13/08 07:38 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: diamond50]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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Eagle
I totally hear and understand you.
You have worked this out so cleverly.
We all learn differently as educators know.A good teacher knows and implements this fact.
Therefore our lifelong learning and developing is accessed similarly.
I learn by reading but absorb more auditory.I listen to tapes and its in my memory bank thereafter,
You may be similar and musicical lyrics can make people patriotic...help fall in love.. so grieving and hurting yes.
Tell me why you repeated listen..Is this you tool to healing?
I want you to heal to a comfortable place where Garry is beside you like he was when you were children .Is there in healthy adulthood.This is his legacy.
The dark days ar prominent I know but if you could find lyrics and mantras (PL's) that bring this place a miracal could happen.
You have aha..moments.does my suggestion sound ok.
You have supported me Sharon and you must know many love you here.I wish I could take you on a walk in my countryside...cry with you then show you a rainbow...
Love Mountain ash
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#151064 - 06/13/08 12:13 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Diamond, thank you for your prayers. This has been a long road, but I'm finally at the point where I can begin to appreciate the good that will come out of this.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151065 - 06/13/08 12:37 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Mountain Ash]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Mountain Ash, your wisdom and voice are always a comfort to me...how I would dearly love to walk through your countryside with you...I surely believe that miracles would happen just in the companioning of each other.
Music has ALWAYS been my companion, comforter, nurturer and my best way through any and every patch of road. Dad used to love telling the story about how throughout my earliest years, he would lie on the couch and I would lie down with my head on his chest and we would listen to music together for hours. He couldn't fathom how an infant/toddler could lie still for so long, but could tell that even at that age the music was clearly soothing and speaking to me.
I don't know why I repeatedly listen to some music...I enjoy exploring all the nuances of the instruments, the lyrics, the harmonies, and this particular song had so many layers of harmonies that I couldn't get enough of it. But once I realized that the one line had started to take on a life and meaning of its own, I stopped listening to the song for now.
I continue to seek that point in the healing process where I can look past the sad memories of Gary's last days and see that legacy of presence that you speak of. I suppose one of the reasons I fill my mind with music these days is that I'm seriously haunted by the memory of his eyes during the several days of seizuring just before he died. Getting past those images seems to be the last hurdle to getting myself through to the other side of this grief. I fill my life with beauty, flowers, music and lyrics to detract myself from those memories, but I have yet to figure out how to either put those images out of sight and out of mind or come to peace with them. I'm getting there, slowly but surely. Wanting and choosing to rise above without my heart being ready to be there too isn't working...it seems I have to allow my heart to make its own way through in its own time and just steer it along in the right direction with the help of uplifting music, positive mantras and the love of caring friends like you.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151066 - 06/13/08 12:54 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Thanks Dotsie. I was so excited to find John Michael Talbot's music last night. I started listening to his stuff way back in 1979, and found much comfort and edification through his lyrics, most of which come straight from the scriptures. I'm looking forward to hearing his music again.
I do listen to mostly uplifting music...I have one playlist with over 400 Christian songs that's often playing while I'm on the computer - Amy Grant, Imperials, Silverwind, Michael W. Smith, Sandi Patty, 2nd Chapter of Acts, Matthew Ward and many others. I guess I underestimated the power of lyrics right now in the space that I'm in these days. Now that I know, I'll be more careful what I listen to.
I've had some difficulty finding what brings sustainable joy...I continue to trust that eventually something somewhere will break through and rekindle that spark. The laughter and care we share here sparks me, as does my rose garden, music - and shopping for shoes (who knew!)
Onward and upward...with the love of caring friends, good songs rolling around the head and the lights turned on, there's only good stuff to think about today!
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151067 - 06/13/08 02:19 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Registered: 04/15/07
Posts: 1341
Loc: Sweden
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Dear Eagleheart..you don´t think that Gary is trying to explain to you why he had to go? When you see his eyes..in torment? It was his TIME and he saw that..he wanted to go..and he wants you now to know why he went when he did? And your desire for beauty as a result of your repeated memeories that give you pain..perhaps he is showing you how to cope..how to go on?? He is there for you..walking every step with you. And he knows you so well..and SEES so much more now..at the other end of eternity..there is so much beauty..and he wants you to see, too..because he sees so much beauty where he is now..  Just thinking aloud with you..
_________________________
"some sacred place.."
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#151069 - 06/13/08 03:36 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Anno]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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Eagle
music mirrors life
Imagine a sonata or long piece and go with it..these composers knew something.
When there is calm in a piece I store this up to be a balm on the next step.Which may be thunderous.
Indeed when the going gets tough I compare the event with the process in an interesting composition.
As with one chapter of a book...it is part of the whole.
My lovely Phil Cunningham composed a piece for his brother Johnny.I posted it here.
He described the composition as his regard and love..then the finality of Johnny death.
I have it bookmarked and when I play it..YET AGAIN..Richard says "I see you are in need of Phil."
There is a pattern...it never fails to touch the heart.Much Scottish/Irish music plays on this due to the enforced emigration and how violin could be carried aboard ship.
I have analysed the concept Identity..and within a course I wrote used music as a tool.Scottish folk music so often speaks of loss leaving parting..never returning.
Eagle keep this post going..this is a hurdle..
and whats stopping you...hop on a plane..come for that walk you could sing for your supper.(sweetly I know)
Mountain ash
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#151070 - 06/13/08 03:41 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Mountain Ash]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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http://www.myspace.com/philcunningham A Bright Star in Cepheus. Listen to this Eagle... Imagine having the talent to write this music for a loved one.Phil did this and I look to the night sky where there are many stars...as you know.
Edited by Mountain Ash (06/13/08 03:46 PM)
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#151072 - 06/13/08 05:39 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: humlan]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Quote:
you don´t think that Gary is trying to explain to you why he had to go? When you see his eyes..in torment? It was his TIME and he saw that..he wanted to go..
His eyes were his only means of communication...and yes, his eyes were begging me to take him off the respirator and let him go. But as long as there was hope of recovery, I couldn't abide by those wishes. By the time we had to let go, there was absolutely nothing left.
He's with me. I feel him, hear him in so many ways. Music was one of our favourite connections...he introduced me to some of the most exquisite music over the years. A few weeks ago, I found a CD (Spirit of the Glen - Scottish music!) quite by accident (?) while surfing along various links on Amazon. Ordered it, and am thoroughly enjoying it. There are pieces on there that I know Gary would have loved, so I mentioned it to him one day and how I missed him sending me beautiful music...his response was "who do you think led you to Spirit in the Glen in the first place?"
I know I'm getting there...I'm discovering that his death represented so much more, and I'm sorting through all of those other related losses as well. The life I have to learn to live now is so totally different from what was my life just over a year ago. I didn't just lose Gary, I lost my entire family and everything that goes with that loss - things as cherished as family gatherings and story-telling (which were regular and beloved events before Gary died) and as mundane as having people to phone and people who phone me...it's all gone. My family was everything to me...I'm still figuring out how to cope - who I am now - without them. Yes, there's much more in my life to be grateful for, and I am grateful, but lots of readjustments to be made in living out the day-to-day stuff. I still keep tripping over the holes.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151073 - 06/13/08 05:45 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Mountain Ash]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Thank you, Mountain Ash...Phil Cunningham's music is beautiful...I bookmarked it and will keep going back to listen through his other offerings as well.
I'm pondering your invitation...it wouldn't be the first time I've sung for my supper LOL. It used to be sweet, but might be a little rusty nowadays! And the memory ain't so great either...I can't remember the words anymore!
But we're about due for another trip soon...I put some of Gary's money away for a grand once-in-a-lifetime trip to Africa; don't know if we're going to be able to make it this year; if we don't, maybe Scotland?
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151074 - 06/13/08 05:52 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: ]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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You do understand, Anne! And those are heavy losses. I'm so sorry that you're going through this...it really is difficult to get one's bearings in such a new (and unwanted) reality.
Hubby and I figured out the other day that between the two of us we've lost 16 members of our families since 1998. And because we've spent so much time with each other's families, each loss is heartfelt by both of us.
All we can do is keep moving forward, trusting that all is as it should be, and like Gims says, that we're learning something crucial in the journeying that will someday help someone else along their way.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151076 - 06/13/08 06:44 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Member
Registered: 01/16/07
Posts: 3404
Loc: USA
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Mountain Ash, the piece is wonderful, so wonderful.
Sharon and Anne I'm sending you two a monstrous cyber hug... hope you can feel it.
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#151077 - 06/13/08 09:57 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: gims]
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Member
Registered: 09/15/05
Posts: 4434
Loc: Minneapolis Minnesota
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Quote:
I didn't just lose Gary, I lost my entire family and everything that goes with that loss - things as cherished as family gatherings and story-telling (which were regular and beloved events before Gary died) and as mundane as having people to phone and people who phone me...it's all gone. My family was everything to me...I'm still figuring out how to cope - who I am now - without them.
I don't understand this, Eagle. Did you have to move? Did I miss something?
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#151078 - 06/13/08 10:23 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Anno]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Anno, this is the part I haven't been able to share about too much here. The week that Gary died, another family crisis occurred which devastated and tore our family apart. For the past year, we've had no contact whatsoever with one brother and his family, and almost non-existent contact with the other brother (he's suffering the ripple effects). We were a very close-knit family before all of this. Now we're completely shattered and even when/if this crisis is resolved, I honestly don't know if we'll ever be able to mend us enough to enjoy family gatherings again. It's all out of our hands and beyond our control at this point, all we can do is weather this through and hope there's something left to salvage on the other side of this crisis. Only one thing's for certain, with Dad, Mom and Gary gone and the scars that this other crisis is leaving on our family, we will never be the same again.
While Gary's death was devastating, this other crisis is what has rocked my entire world and sense of direction...it has forced me to learn that sometimes all we can do is to allow others to be who they are without allowing their choices and behaviours to destroy who we are; my focus all year has been figuring out how to get on with my own life without them when their lives have been so intrinsically woven in and through mine for 40+ years.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151079 - 06/14/08 12:49 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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Eagle
you are slowly explaining more and I wont ask further but this must be painful.
But as I grow older many of the sayings that were quoted by my Grandmother are clearer.
She would say things almost like a riddle..and I tried to understand but now I see "through the mirror clearly"
One was "I wont be here to see it but rest assured right will out."
meaning I suppose that in time injustice would be sorted out.
It is unjust that you were hurt more at a very vulnerable time. That was wrong.Whatever the reason.
Missing phone calls is understandable and can you substitute others who fill that role.
Due to my own family circumstances I have more friends than family.Yet my childhood was overflowing with family.
Thing is being reared by Grandparents means I lost them early.
In one year five cousins of my Mothers who were close all died. A whole family..Two were unmarried.One childless.
I became stunned as that year unfolded it was like a sick movie...funerals.
Draw closer then closer still to those who nurture you.Seek and yee shall find.
Mountain ash
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#151080 - 06/14/08 01:25 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Mountain Ash]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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It's interesting to note that since I became aware of how that line had been affecting me, my mind has been much clearer and I've been able to reassert my positive focus without so much resistance. That line seems to have taken on a taunting aspect...but every time I hear it beginning to play in my head again, I immediately stop it and substitute something positive ("Jesus be my light" fits right into the same melody).
I'm taken aback, even after all these years, of just how insidious something like a simple line from a song can become. There's nothing wrong with this song or that line - but for me, it took on very negative connotations and became a dangerous quicksand into which my spirit and mind were sinking fast.
I wonder now, if we think our children are not being affected by the lyrics of the music they're listening to, we're just fooling ourselves. While some can resist being dragged into the underlying nuances of the words, there are others much more fragile in spirit who must be succumbing to the messages of futility and violence and negativity that are pouring into their ears and minds.
I thought I had evolved past the point where this sort of thing could affect me to this extent. It's a lovely song, with beautiful musicality - I didn't see the potential for anything more than blissful listening pleasure. Now I realize yet again that when you're prone to mangled thinking (symptomatic of depression, anxiety disorders and other mental illnesses), you always has to be on guard against whatever tools that mangled thinking can use against you.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151083 - 06/14/08 08:25 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: ]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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And I keep you in heart and prayer too, Anne...we're pilgrims on the same road...the best silver linings that shine out of these stormy patches of road are the special people who touch our hearts and lives along the way. The women here on BWS are such blessings and gifts. If it's loss and lostness that brought me here, it's the wisdom, friendships and laughter found here that make it all worthwhile! If I hadn't been so broken, I would never have found BWS, and I shudder to think how empty my life would be without these amazing, caring women who are now the dearest people in the world to me.
God promises that "all things work together for those who love the Lord". When we keep our eyes and hearts open, that promise comes true in the most amazing, unexpected, life-lifting ways - BWS was one way that I could never have imagined before stumbling in here! Now I can't imagine my life without this place and these women.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151085 - 06/14/08 10:20 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Anno]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Quote:
When Gary was in the hospital, didn't you mention the book, The Secret, and you were reading it? Or maybe it was another book, but it seemed to be just the right thing for you at the time. Maybe it would help again, now?
Yes, Anno, I remember mentioning The Secret way back then. Somebody left the book in the ICU for Gary and I started reading it and was very excited by it. I read parts of it out loud to Gary (through a hot and steamy mask as I recall well, because he was so vulnerable to infections that everyone had to be gowned and masked.)
Anyway, when my older brother arrived, we read parts of the book out loud to Gary and to each other. We practised envisioning the best parking spaces in the parkade every morning, and that worked. So we became somewhat immersed in this whole "law of attraction" and positive vibe thing, so much so that I became unshakeably certain that Gary would survive...so much so that after he died and everyone else left the room, I stayed for 30 minutes because I was SO SURE that God would send him back. I was afraid that if I left, it would negate the "positive belief vibe" that Gary was coming back. It was so hard to finally give up and leave him there. Even then, I stayed out in the hallway for awhile, waiting to hear an announcement for our family to return to ICU. It was crazy, I know, but that's how immersed I was in that whole positive thinking/secret/law of attraction stuff. It didn't work for us, and it was a crushing blow to me. And in hindsight, being so immersed in that unrealistic positive "vibing" blinded me to the reality - and robbed me of the precious opportunity to really be present to Gary in his final days and hours.
I have great difficulty understanding how to make the Secret work now. I've delved into the Law of Allowing, and that has helped tremendously, from the perspective of allowing people to be who they are without allowing their beliefs and actions to define or diminish me. And I believe in the concept of the Law of Attraction - and have read several books on it, and am practising it, albeit half-heartedly, which I hear prevents it from working. But I'll admit that I became frightened when the money I had jokingly asked for when my older brother and I were practising the Secret came out of Gary's estate...that was too high a cost to pay, and now I'm (ridiculously) afraid to ever ask for money again for fear of whose life will coincidentally end just as that money comes to me.
I know that's not how it works, but it still spooked me too much to be comfortable with asking for anything - or knowing what to ask for. I just stick to the generics - good health, enough money to be able pay for whatever we need, and a mended family. Two out of three ain't bad...
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151086 - 06/15/08 08:21 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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Five days after my Granmother died we had the funeral.I was in her bedroom and all our relatives in the sitting room along the hall even on stairs.The time came for her to go in the car..I had this moment of...
I must now tell all these people this is a mistake..that they have come in vain..that I alone could wake her up.
of course the event went ahead and we all followd in a procession.
This illustrates the "Maddness" grief gifts.An unwelcome Universal package for some.
Rationally a small part knew I was mistaken...that passed and I entered a period of inertia.Just for a few days.My husband bought me an old car..I took my son to a creche went to a typing class...collect my daughter from school ..took my son to the park collected my daughter from school took them to the library..and on and on. If I had not had the children I may have curled up and hoped to die just to be beside her.
It took 25 years to write the poem LOST which doesnt start to tell Eagle what the grieving was like.It is huge scary and awful,But it gift also compassion for others in that place and a desire to do good in her memory in her name and because she gifted me good life.
Gary gifted you a good life.Dont be guilty..that is supersticous and totally understandable.Just the way you see the fact you got a legacy.I am not guily that Gran adopted me just eternally grateful.
We need to share a few confidences like I did with you yesterday..
Books do not have all the answers..they have clues.The only real book is each's own testimony.whether written or experienced.
We share so much on this forum..In writing this I realise one difference is I had my babies to tend for immediatly after the funeral..they gave a focus so there holds one difference anbout being a parent.They were part of my darling..Gran and therefor precious.
Also I was young you were mature when Gary passed and knew more..also the other private issue you shared..
Other may read this and undestand or it may incite yet another private nasty missive to me.
Know what ? I can handle that.Because Eagle you deserve to reach a place of healing.
Mountain ash
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#151087 - 06/15/08 01:54 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Mountain Ash]
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Member
Registered: 09/26/04
Posts: 3910
Loc: Alabama
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quote:The only real book is each's own testimony.whether written or experienced.
How true Mountain and may I add well put.
Quote: Other may read this and undestand or it may incite yet another private nasty missive to me.
MA, Am I to take from this that someone is PM'ing you a nasty message. Hopefully I have misunderstood that this is what you are saying.
_________________________
chick
~ Here is the test to find whether your mission on Earth is finished: if you're alive, it isn't ~
~ Prayer is the most we can do for another human being ~
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#151088 - 06/15/08 02:41 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: chickadee]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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Yes nasty messages but on a server not through here.
I did get one cyptic PM and therefor connect the two issues.
I have sympathy for anyone who does these "green ink " things.
However I have boundries and share with caution.Due in part to being from a small country and anyone with a mind to could identify me.Knowing my name alone also a no no....I can google myself..easy as pie
.I do this to allow privicy for loved ones as much as myself.
But the support PM are continue to be appreciated.I changed my email address.and trusted people have that.
and with my poetry site..a pen name which means artistic license.
we are all different.
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#151089 - 06/15/08 03:21 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Mountain Ash]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Mountain Ash, your beauty shines and your wisdom radiates and touches so profoundly. It's incomprehensible that anyone would attack you or your immense generosity of heart here. When people do that, it speaks much more about them and their smallness of heart. But I know it hurts nevertheless to bear the brunt of that pettiness. I hope and pray that you remain safe, supported and appreciated here, because you are an awesome woman, and a miracle from God for so many of us here.
I too love your phraseology about the only real book being each person's own testimony. How profoundly wise and uplifting that is.
Today my heart is so much lighter and "sparked" than it has been in many, many months. I've been soaking in the wisdom here, practising positive focus, exercising forgiveness of others and self in regard to tired old regrets and am resolved to face the sun, fill my mind and life with praise and beauty, and move ahead with the power of renewed faith in God and self. Much healing over the past few days. Becoming aware of how easily my mind can still be influenced by what I allow to fill it has been an immense step forward. I had become complacent, but realize now that I cannot afford that luxury.
I also recognize that my faith - in God, in others, in self - cannot be dependent on feelings, since feelings change with the wind and cannot be depended upon as solid ground. My faith has to be steeped in KNOWING, not feeling, so that no matter what I feel today or tomorrow, my faith will withstand the roller coaster ride and carry me through on a much steadier course. That's not to deny the feelings, they will continue to come and they will go; it's just a conscious choice now to not rebuild my days, hope and self on such shakey ground, but to remember that faith-based-on-truth is a much more trustworthy foundation on which to rebuild this new life and future.
Onward and upward! On Eagle's wings, no less...
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151090 - 06/15/08 05:45 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Registered: 04/15/07
Posts: 1341
Loc: Sweden
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Eagleheart..but truth is a changing thing,too? Or what do you say? I find this very exciting and not threatening..but that´s me. They say that the only thing you can count on is change..and death, I guess. What do you think??? And my truth doesn´t have to be your truth.. HUUUGS! And just thinking with you..I hope that´s OK?
_________________________
"some sacred place.."
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#151091 - 06/15/08 06:07 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: humlan]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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The sermon today was about
David and Goliath
The Minister sais "Lets learn together.."
and after the text he spoke about how our Giants(Golaiths) are all different.Some may be a bad marriage a bad relationship ..boss..etc.It could be debt or every which ever.
He talked about being armed with then "Truth" our Faith.
So is the task seeking and finding our truth?
I've kinda worked out my values and put to rest any past issues where I may have been confused.
At this moment evening here I am already loking forward to another day where I may paint my bench or weed a flower patch.
Eagle what a journay..from lsitening to that song to clearer thoughts.
Think of bigotry and how people march to songs and drums and have killed others in their belief that the words are true.
I site..the Catholic/Protestant marchs which happen in Ireland and Scotland. Not my way at all.
So lyrics are words which can hurt or heal
Mountain ash
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#151092 - 06/15/08 06:12 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Mountain Ash]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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Something from my folder
.................................
The Wonder of Words ©
Fife, Scotland
2005
Some words when woven are blankets
They allow warmth to penetrate bones
Others are crystal clear
They are the testimony to the poet's
Clarity of seeing
Yet some amuse and tickle the fancy
Of children to be remembered with
Fond smiles and passed down for posterity
Seductive words joined by red roses
And champagne serve their purpose
Descriptive words enhance the seeing eye
For me forget-me-not says it all
A flower for my heart
The wonder is how from those early
Cave messages tantalisingly obscure
We have progressed as far as to
Dissect emotions, code them and pass on
Through a poet's eye all life's drama
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#151093 - 06/16/08 01:10 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: humlan]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Quote:
Eagleheart..but truth is a changing thing,too? And my truth doesn´t have to be your truth..
I think that there are as many versions or colours of a truth as there are people...we all view life through our own unique interpretation process, which is based on our unique history, experience, insight and level of woundedness. To try and tackle universal truth here would be impossible. And I too hold that my truth is not - and doesn't have to be - anyone else's truth.
I can only speak from within my own searching...what I determine as a truth that I can/want to live by is whatever draws me into closer, healthier communion/relationship with God - a truth which in effect draws me out of myself and lifts me up to see "more" than my grief.
For instance, one of the messages I hear over and over again through journalling and meditation is that I'm here to learn how to love and how to be loved. That sounds simple, but it's not. And by choosing that as one of my truths, I've come to learn that every person who comes into my life is there for a reason, either to teach me more about loving and being loved, or is there because I have learned something that I can now use to help them as they struggle along their way. So this truth impels me always upward and forward, out of self, and into perspective - searching for what it is I'm supposed to learn from whatever events are happening in my life and world - and to learn from and/or help whoever God sends into my life during that time.
The little nugget of truth that I found yesterday was a simple but profound one (for me): that God is worthy of my love and praise even when I don't FEEL like loving or praising Him. I've gotten hazy in my grief, thinking that my misery and sadness gave me the right to avoid God whenever I felt too miserable to talk with Him. I realized yesterday how wrong that is, that no matter what my FEELINGS are on any given day, God is still worthy of my time, gratitude, presence and praise.
That's a liberating truth for me...yes, there are times when sadness makes it difficult to find words to speak, but both He and I know that there's a difference between approaching Him with wounded silence and approaching Him with fake bravado or plying Him with lots of excuses for NOT spending time with Him...one speaks volumes without saying a word, the other speaks nothing despite using volumes of words.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151094 - 06/16/08 01:26 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Mountain Ash]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Beautiful, Mountain Ash. I learned the hard way many years ago what a "two-edged sword" words can be. As I've evolved into increased awareness, so has my sense of responsibility to take better care that I use whatever "gift of words" God has given me to edify, encourage and empower rather than to diminish, destroy and debilitate. When you know words and how to use them, both are equally possible.
That reminds me of the year that I gave up "gossiping" for Lent. I had fallen into the habit of participating in the office gossip sessions at work (they could get very malicious), and was becoming very uncomfortable with how it made me feel about myself. So I gave it up, and it made an enormous difference inside of me. When Lent ended, I resolved to make that change a permanent one. I still get sucked into gossiping once in awhile, but bad-mouthing others leaves such a bad taste in my mouth now that I can't do it anymore. It's hard to be strong, especially when I'm so lonely, but I find that now I have to stop the conversation, say that I cannot participate in this kind of discussion and, if it continues, I walk away. It doesn't make me very popular, but I like myself a whole lot better!
Words are powerful entities. That saying: "bricks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me"? I don't swallow that for a moment...the ability to detach ourself from the woundings may be something we strive for, but in my experience, words do indeed impact on us and resound through our brains and being long after the scars from a brick or stone have disappeared.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151096 - 06/16/08 04:36 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: jabber]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Jabber, that's the reality of aging, isn't it, one loss after another. Because so many died around the same time, I didn't really have time to process. Recognizing now that there will be more to come, I have to come to peace with this cycle of life...to mourn but without allowing the losses to derail me to this extent again. And to celebrate life!
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151097 - 06/17/08 02:01 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Member
Registered: 11/11/04
Posts: 3503
Loc: Colorado
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Hello. I came to BWS tonight with full intention of getting caught up on the posts. I've only read this thread, which is quite profound and thought provoking. Except I never thought of God as unworthy of our love. I've thought in terms of me being unworthy of God's love, or that I had no love to give God, or that my love was not pure enough. One of the thoughts that keeps me going during suicidal thinking is that I learned to love God, and learned that God loves even me, and God gave me life for a reason, and therefore if I destroy life, I am destroying something God created and loved, and what right do I have to do that? Anyway, truth has changed. In my twenties I had an affirmation, "I know all I need to know for my soul to be at peace." However, even as I said that once in a while, I knew there was truth to be told. It took 2 decades to know the truth. Much like it takes 2 decades to write a poem that you know is there, but ... And the truth is scarey, but I would never go back to before the truth. Yes, truth changes. What I once knew as the truth was someone else's truth, my family's false truth, which I took on as my own. So much better to know your own full and authentic truth. Well, I ramble. And I am too tired to go on reading. But I'm glad I came upon this thoughtful and supportive thread. Love and Light, PL
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#151098 - 06/17/08 08:18 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Princess Lenora]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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Hello PL
Its good to hear you again.
I dont understand what you mean.
"Hello. I came to BWS tonight with full intention of getting caught up on the posts. I've only read this thread, which is quite profound and thought provoking. Except I never thought of God as unworthy of our love. I've thought in terms of me being unworthy of God's love,"
Mountain ash
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#151099 - 06/17/08 11:46 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Mountain Ash]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Mountain Ash, Princess Lenora might have been referring to my earlier post about my truth...I had mentioned my realization that my faith had to be grounded in KNOWING, not FEELING - and my recognition that God was worthy of my love and praise even when I didn't FEEL like loving or praising Him. My statement wasn't really about God being worthy of my love, but more about withholding my love and presence from Him because of how I feel, which of course changes on any given day, or even moment by moment, meaning that my Love for Him, or at least my profession of love and praise, would be subject to however I happened to be feeling. I realized the other day that that was wrong (for me) to treat God (or any loved one) with such fickle respect.
I'm wired to operate out of emotion - that will never change. What has to change is how I manage those emotions, how I learn to mature my emotional base so that I'm not defined or ruled by such unreliable roller-coaster feelings. I thought I had figured it out, but grief has a nasty habit of relapsing us into ungracious chaos for awhile, doesn't it!
Anyway, I think that PL's statement "I never thought of God as unworthy of our love" might have been a response to my post about realizing that He's worthy of my love even when I don't feel that love. I was very angry with Him for a long time - I never stopped loving Him, I just withdrew from him, not knowing how to approach and talk with Him through that rage and utter sense of betrayal of trust. I HATED that He didn't give Gary back. But we're working through it together...He's mending those holes, slowly but surely, with great tenderness and understanding, and has helped me to understand that He yearns for my companionship and presence, even when I'm too angry and/or wounded to speak.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151100 - 06/17/08 12:09 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Member
Registered: 01/16/07
Posts: 3404
Loc: USA
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Poor God, we do put him through a lot, don't we? One of my favorite Dolly Parton songs (don't watch the youtube video; it takes away from the soundtrack): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRzrHB2qhNM
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#151101 - 06/17/08 12:30 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: gims]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Gims, He told me once that He had big shoulders and didn't mind me throwing stuff at Him...the image that came with the words was too funny. One of the things I love most about God is how He breaks through my anger with stuff that makes me laugh...it's sort of unfair, in a tender humourous way.
Just another short story about how He uses humour to break through: I clearly remember one day about 32 years ago. I forget why, but I was angry over something going on in my life at the time, and took it out on God (well, He was/has always been my most constant companion, so isn't that who we usually fling our bad moods at, the ones closest to us, even if they least deserve it?!) Anyway, I left home very early in the morning and told God I was too angry with Him for not fixing things, and wasn't in the mood to speak to Him today.
So the day goes by, very busy. As I was walking home, I so wanted to talk with God about the day, but I was too proud to break my promise NOT to talk with Him today. Suddenly one of the most gorgeous sunsets breaks out in front of me. The entire sky was bathed in brilliant oranges, reds and purples. It was indescribably spectacular - one of the best I've ever seen. Well, I just had to laugh right out loud and tell Him - that's not fair, Lord, you know I can't see something like that without thanking You!
We've had a lot of fun together. He must miss it as much as I do...
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151103 - 06/17/08 01:10 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: gims]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Gims, I'd never heard that song before. It's giving me goose bumps too. I finally found this one, wanted to share it here too... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmXPfGzfqWU
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151104 - 06/17/08 01:39 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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Don't you think a wise Father lets his children react in the given moment..
From this authentic feeling (at the time) we are taught balance.
Do you ever feel God patting you on the head..?
I do.
Thank for pointing me to the queries answer Eagle.
Mountain ash
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#151106 - 06/17/08 02:22 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: jabber]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Jabber, it's really hard to watch the people we love suffer without questioning why, perhaps moreso when those people have strong faith and a history of solid relationship with God. The only thing that makes any sense at all to me is that there is more to the picture than what little of it we are able to see - and there is more to the ripple effect of our actions, journeys and even our deaths than what we are likely to experience in our lifetime. We are pieces of a Master Plan that looks far beyond this moment in time to a greater good and a greater glory somewhere farther down the road, perhaps farther than we ourselves will be able to travel.
I think of Terry Fox. He's a beloved Canadian hero who started running across Canada - on one leg and a prosthesis, because he had lost one leg to cancer - to raise funds for cancer research. He had to quit half-way across because his cancer, which had been in remission, recurred, and soon after, he died. At first, everyone thought that his dream would die with him. But now, 28 years later, his legacy lives on through yearly "marathons of hope" that go on across the world - to date, more than $400 million has been raised worldwide for cancer research in Terry's name. Who could have predicted that one man's death would have such an amazing, world-changing ripple effect. In effect, his death was what allowed this particular miracle to come alive - and it's still alive, long after everyone asked why God had taken this wonderfully, gifted compassionate man at such a young age. Now the "why" is much clearer.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151107 - 06/19/08 02:24 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Member
Registered: 11/11/04
Posts: 3503
Loc: Colorado
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Hi again, MA, I'm not even sure I know what I meant. My comment was in response to something Eagle had said. I'm thinking now of the biography that was written about Mother Theresa. In the biography there is a statement of faith. Even with Mother Theresa, her faith wandered. I don't think of myself as fickle. But definitly ambivalent. Eagle, your description of how you use words was so good I wrote it down. PL
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#151109 - 06/19/08 01:16 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: jabber]
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Registered: 08/22/07
Posts: 1761
Loc: Southern Maine, USA
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We need to always remember that God answers all our prayers....however, they're not always the answers we had hoped for. The important thing to remember is that He knows best and to trust in that. This is where deep faith comes in!
_________________________
If we couldn't laugh we would all go insane ~ Jimmy Buffett
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#151110 - 06/19/08 01:24 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: jabber]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Princess Lenora, ambivalence could well be a frustrating reality for anyone who has faith and deep compassion...for Mother Theresa, it must have been so difficult to see such suffering and not question God about the 'why' of it. Or the 'why' of unanswered prayers. The 'why' of beautiful innocent children being thrown away like trash. IMO, the deeper your faith/belief in God, the more impossible it becomes to witness that day in and day out without questioning God's apparent silence and inactivity. The closest I've ever come to finding any remotely palatable answer was in Betty J. Eadie's book, "Embraced by the Light". http://embracedbythelight.com/index.htm It changed my life, and continues to be my best way through my own tangle of why's.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151111 - 06/19/08 04:39 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Registered: 08/22/07
Posts: 1761
Loc: Southern Maine, USA
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Very wise counsel, Eagle. I stepped into my former self (pastor's wife and teacher) when I made the above statement. While true and biblical, it was rather black and white. In no way would I mean that we never or should never ask "why" of God. We do. We're human and can't have the mind of God ourselves. We do question the seemingly unanswered prayers or what we perceive as God's silence to us. The silence is deafening and at times we feel abandoned. It's excrutiating in those times.
_________________________
If we couldn't laugh we would all go insane ~ Jimmy Buffett
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#151112 - 06/19/08 06:08 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Member
Registered: 01/16/07
Posts: 3404
Loc: USA
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Her books helped me, too, EH... mostly in the area of why we are on earth in earthly form, in whatever capacity. I think I came away from her writings accepting we are here to learn lessons*. If the common idea of similar authors, that we choose how we come to earth to learn necessary lessons, is correct, we need not be concerned by social, economical, familial, and so on, situations we witness on earth. If the idea is correct, each capacity we live in is chosen by us. That does not mean we ignore, because lessons to be learned and practiced include God's three fundamentals: hope, faith, love (charity) - hearts would be saddened.
*Other authors examine and endorse this possibility (probability, for some), going as far as supporting the idea of reincarnation. One book I read, not too long ago, claimed reincarnation was an acceptable belief before the Council got busy defining a uniform doctrine. It gave the reason that, if the body of Christendom were given license to believe in reincarnation, they'd be less likely to conform immediately to the newly defined and prescribed doctrine, because they'd have more time (lives) to accept the new statements of beliefs as defined by the Council. That's why the Council edited out reincarnation. (I'd love to hear what Lola has to say on this.)
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#151113 - 06/19/08 07:30 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: gims]
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Member
Registered: 01/16/07
Posts: 3404
Loc: USA
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I need to ask a question - something similar to the importance of our thoughts, but drilling down to the words (in and of thoughts). If you were to say, read or hear this about someone(s), what would you be thinking - negative, positive, or cautiously neutral: Look at (insert individual/pair/group), so unique - but, we are proud of (him/her/them), aren't we? If you would, before answering, think of it from a negative perspective, a positive perspective, and a cautious one, each, applying a pointed subjectivity (kind of making it personal), then answer. And, if you would, please explain how you came to your answer. Thanks!!!
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#151115 - 06/19/08 08:10 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: gims]
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Member
Registered: 06/23/06
Posts: 3703
Loc: London UK
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Gims, the Nicene Councils and the Ecumenical Council of Constantinople never discussed reincarnation. Where it was mentioned in the latter, it was only raised in so far as to condemn it. 'Where the notion of reincarnation proposes that death does not bring finality but endless opportunities for souls to live over and over again, the Christian belief is that one's body is as unique to its own spirit.' The destiny is resurrection not reincarnation as held by the Profession of Faith (Nicene Creed). For Christendom to believe in the latter, one must find some biblical evidence to support it and contrary to Heb. 9:27 "it is appointed that men die once, and after this comes judgment" As such, our Catechism is as follows:- 1013 Death is the end of man's earthly pilgrimage, of the time of grace and mercy which God offers him so as to work out his earthly life in keeping with the Divine plan, and to decide his ultimate destiny. When "the single course of our earthly life" is completed, we shall not return to other earthly lives: "It is appointed for men to die once." Quote:
...claimed reincarnation was an acceptable belief before the Council got busy defining a uniform doctrine.
By Christians? Did the book cite an authority on this basis? Did it offer any discourse on Easter?
Edited by Lola (06/19/08 09:07 PM)
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#151117 - 06/19/08 10:13 PM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Edelweiss]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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Negative
Unique
We are all uniquue even to our twin.
But
like others say the word "but" concerns me
Aren't we
No one else should make an assumsion on what I would believe
I see the statement as a "value statement "
because
How could I know what someone else views as unique
How could I accept that the proviso "but"
due to this being dependant on the first line..
How could I answer to anything as complex with a simple
yes or no. So I would ask for a clearer statement..then dependant on that..review my thoughts.
Why do you ask
Mountain ash
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#151118 - 06/20/08 02:12 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: gims]
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Member
Registered: 03/22/05
Posts: 4876
Loc: Canada
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Quote:
I think I came away from her writings accepting we are here to learn lessons*.
Gims, what uncanny timing for this comment. I had an amazing session with my therapist today. We talked about regrets - as some of you know, I am tortured by regrets, stemming all the way back to childhood. Regret has been an overwhelming debilitator in my life.
But today, she told me how she sees regrets in a positive light - how they teach us important lessons. So as 'homework', she asked me to write down some of my regrets, determine the lessons I've learned from those regrets and the ways I've been able to apply those lessions in other chapters of my life.
So I started doing that tonight, and was AWED by what I began to see. Every regret had its lesson, a lesson that I was clearly able to apply later in another similar situation...not only that, but every regret (so far) eventually evolved into a GIFT. For example, I was not there for my Mom when she went through her breast cancer - I was working thousands of miles away, and had no clue what cancer was at that time - didn't understand what she was going through. It wasn't until years later that I realized how awful it was for her to have to go through that without much support. After she died (from mestasized cancer) I was overwhelmed with regret for not having been there for her for that earlier bout of cancer. Until tonight, I hadn't made the conscious connection between that regret and my passion to be there for Gary. So the lesson learned was that we can't ever get back whatever time we lose by not being there for someone - and how nothing is more important (for me) than being there for my family. My application of the lesson learned came when Gary got sick, and without hesitation I dropped everything to be there for him. The GIFT that I was able to give to Gary was pure presence. He always knew that there was nowhere else I'd rather be than right there beside him.
So I took this exercise a little further and came up with a formula for the evolution of regret...I think this may be a threshold for me...
Regret ~ Lesson Learned ~ Application ~ Gift = Glass Half Full!
The "Glass Half Full" attitude has been impossible for me to even glimpse much less actually feel ever since Gary died. I may have just made a 180 degree turn tonight.
_________________________
When you don't like a thing, change it.
If you can't change it, change the way you think about it.
(Maya Angelou)
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#151119 - 06/20/08 07:28 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Eagle Heart]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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Eagle You said
I was working thousands of miles away, and had no clue what cancer was at that time - didn't understand what she was going through. It wasn't until years later that I realized how awful it was for her to have to go through that without much support.
....................
Read that again..Eagle
Your were earning your living..not in the next street neglecting to visit.
I think if we can accept we did "our best at that time" then life evens out.
Also
"when I was a child I spoke as a child" I paraphase.
We are children in some areas of our lives long after we attain adulthood.That is how we evolve.
seems to me your therapist is being helpful
Mountain ash
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#151120 - 06/20/08 07:40 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Mountain Ash]
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The Divine Ms M
Registered: 07/07/03
Posts: 4894
Loc: Orange County, California
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Quote:
Look at (insert individual/pair/group), so unique - but, we are proud of (him/her/them), aren't we?
Gims, it's condescending. First, Quote:
look at
implies at arms length, pointing at someone like an object
Quote:
so unique
Oh, aren't we so proud of ourself for saying something nice about them? We could've said odd.
Quote:
but, we are proud of (him/her/them), aren't we?
BUUTTTT -- it hurts us to say this, especially since we never really liked them anyhow, but since they've succeeded despite our low opinions of them, maybe we should say something nice and pretend to look like we mean it.
Like I said,
Quote:
Condescending.
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#151123 - 06/21/08 06:40 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
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Member
Registered: 01/16/07
Posts: 3404
Loc: USA
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dots, EW, MA, and MB... you all read it the way I did... Now, here are the actual words... see if it changes the way you feel about the statement in any way: This (a couple) is a unique pair - but we are proud of them, aren't we? I'll explain more after I get your inputs.
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#151125 - 06/21/08 07:27 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Edelweiss]
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Member
Registered: 01/16/07
Posts: 3404
Loc: USA
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[Quote]
Gims, the Nicene Councils and the Ecumenical Council of Constantinople never discussed reincarnation. Where it was mentioned in the latter, it was only raised in so far as to condemn it. 'Where the notion of reincarnation proposes that death does not bring finality but endless opportunities for souls to live over and over again, the Christian belief is that one's body is as unique to its own spirit.' The destiny is resurrection not reincarnation as held by the Profession of Faith (Nicene Creed). For Christendom to believe in the latter, one must find some biblical evidence to support it and contrary to Heb. 9:27 "it is appointed that men die once, and after this comes judgment"
This doesn't totally negate the ideas in the book, because of the word men (as in earthly human form). The argument was more about the soul as a lifeform - I know it's farfetched... and because I'm no theologian or Bible scholar, it made me wonder what the original writing actually stated, before translation(s). What I was reading had the controversal argument going - similar to the argument they claimed was thrown at the N. Council by early church fathers (unidentified) - that we have lessons to learn in each 'life' (used loosely). Gnostics was referenced... which is an argument in itself... but, the argument was that there are planes, and the soul finishes it's lesson on this 'earth' to go on to the next. The way it read, it sounded as if it were other 'earths' planes. Never was clear on that point. But, knowing there are three (biblical) heavens , I entertained the ideas ... (you would probably be shocked at the thoughts I entertain).
[Quote]
By Christians? Did the book cite an authority on this basis? Did it offer any discourse on Easter?
I hardly ever read references, but there were some. And, no, nothing referenced Easter.
Edited by gims (06/21/08 07:30 AM)
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#151127 - 06/21/08 07:52 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Lola]
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Member
Registered: 01/16/07
Posts: 3404
Loc: USA
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EW, me too... Lola, Oh No!  At the same time, I hope you are right and I hope you are wrong. The response, although delayed and well thought out (thought as much, anyway) might need follow-up. Reading and rereading, numerous times... because of the conjunction used, I take the word 'unique' as negative... the 'aren't we' being an added stinger, pinging off the negative nature assumedly created by the conjunctive clause. But, with little effort, I see how the latter clause might be a playful question. Then I mentally flip back to the negative connotation given the word 'unique.' 
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#151128 - 06/21/08 08:56 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: gims]
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Member
Registered: 06/23/06
Posts: 3703
Loc: London UK
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The first clause is a subjective assumption by the speaker or writer and ought not to be assessed as mutually agreed at first instance because, what is presented "unique" might not have that connotation for others.
_________________________
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#151129 - 06/21/08 11:09 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Lola]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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a playful question.
Interesting.this slant.
I however feel that as someone speaks (in this cae making an assumption) they can change the way the statement mean covering their back..by lightening it .
They may do this due to the listeners body language and other non verbal cues.
I saw it a lot between teenage students..who would say things to each other for impact..then say "Just joking!!"
It was appropiate for them ..they were deveolping and how better than by practicing communication.
I have also seen it used as a sketch at the theatre..to set the scene where a Mother dying to have her daughter married had a cope..eg.abbreviations.N O O U( Not one of us.)used in the context of wealth and class and only the husband knew what it meant.
language is powerful.I listen carefully to what is being said..and think before I reply.
When something is said that I disagree with I will say Lets agree to disagree.
Mountain ash
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#151130 - 06/22/08 06:32 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: gims]
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Member
Registered: 06/23/06
Posts: 3703
Loc: London UK
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Quote:
This doesn't totally negate the ideas in the book, because of the word men (as in earthly human form). The argument was more about the soul as a lifeform - I know it's farfetched... and because I'm no theologian or Bible scholar, it made me wonder what the original writing actually stated, before translation(s). What I was reading had the controversal argument going - similar to the argument they claimed was thrown at the N. Council by early church fathers (unidentified) - that we have lessons to learn in each 'life' (used loosely). Gnostics was referenced... which is an argument in itself... but, the argument was that there are planes, and the soul finishes it's lesson on this 'earth' to go on to the next. The way it read, it sounded as if it were other 'earths' planes. Never was clear on that point. But, knowing there are three (biblical) heavens , I entertained the ideas ... (you would probably be shocked at the thoughts I entertain) .
Gims, the arguments would have been conducted in the language of that time, predominantly Greek. But one trusts that the translations into Latin and English are sound. If you want further reading you can go by the books on Early Fathers i.e. Ante Nicene, Nicene and Post Nicene which would contain a vast collection of arguments on soul. There is also the Summa Theologica and Libra Graduum (Syriac Christianity) which would also have its counterpart in English. Buddhist and Hindu materials also offer the varying discourse on different levels of "heaven and earth".
I find it a healthy exercise to study other thoughts, Gims. It is the only way we can appreciate and understand what others believe and why they do.
_________________________
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#151131 - 06/22/08 08:43 AM
Re: The Importance of Our Thoughts
[Re: Lola]
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Member
Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 3027
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Lola your belief is shared by me.
Lola siad "I find it a healthy exercise to study other thoughts, Gims. It is the only way we can appreciate and understand what others believe and why they do."
I just love a mixed gathering where someone discusses some issue..it can be personal or shared due to being in the news.Or inherited through culture.
Then when I ask for more information they provide further facts which enhance my understanding.Then I sift this new knowledge as I go about my days.
Mountain ash
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