Sabra, everyone here who loves God loves Him with all their hearts and souls and also wants to share the Good News...I have loved God since I was a child, and that faith has been tempered and tested by more agony than I can write here (but most of it's in my book).

I used to live my life "by the Book", almost killing myself (literally) trying to do the right thing and follow the rules right to the letter of the Scriptural law. It wasn't until I was (again literally) born again in the ICU after a suicide attempt that my eyes were open to the Truth that would set me free...that I am loved unconditionally.

I still believe in the Bible, and I love every word and every morsel of love and mercy that I now read within every word. But I can no longer go back to believing that life (or God) is as "black and white" "right or wrong" as I did before that epiphany in the ICU. It would be impossible for me to go back to believing that there's no such thing as grey area where God is concerned. Because I have lived most of my life in the grey area, and I know with absolute certainty that I am not nor will I ever be beyond redemption. Not only that, but I know with all my heart that just as much as you love God and love to share His wonderful news, God is infinitely more in love with us. And in that powerful but vulnerable (yes, vulnerable) hunger to be in a tender, loving, personal relationship with us, He uses every possible means to reach us. That means that He wears different faces and allows Himself to be called different names, because He is so in love with ALL of His children, that He will do whatever it takes to reach each and every one exactly where they are.

I don't understand all the ramifications of that, I don't pretend to, but I know with every fiber of my being and soul that this Almighty Creator God stoops as low as He has to to sit in the same dirt and muck and filth that any one of His children sits in, and Loves them right there, just the way they are.

That depth of Love is the Good News. That compassionate God with dirt underneath His fingernails is the Good News. That Healing Love that shows Itself in a multitude of creative impossible-to-resist loving ways is the Good News.

There's no shooting of messengers here. Just other perspectives, other voices crying out in the wilderness that there's more to this God than we could ever imagine and we cannot ever box Him into what we think He ought to be. We each bring our experiences and insights to the table and together we build additional epiphany and "food for thought" for each other.

[ July 07, 2005, 12:52 AM: Message edited by: Eagle Heart ]

Dotsie and Eagle -- wow!

I haven't read the entire thread yet - but was very moved by your entries!

I went to an Easter play up at the Christian playhouse in PA a few years back (you know the one, Dotsie)...

And I'll never forget when Jesus was in the upper room with his disciples...and you know that the very words of a man facing his death are pointed...and he said to his disciples, "by THIS all men shall know that you are my disciples...when you have LOVE for one another".

WOW. I was changed forever. I realized that he could have said 1,000 things....

"They will know you are my disciples when...

you memorize the bible...
go to church every day...
live a holy life..., etc, etc, etc"

But no. That's not what he said.

And that is MY philisophy...that my job is to love people right where they are at. What greater gift can we give someone then to love them unconditionally as the Father loves us!

God's love doesn't demand a change...
It produces a change...

Praise HIM in this place!

d.

I love that this forum does not bash people who differ in thoughts or beliefs! This place is a safe-haven for all women -- seeking life, seeking friendship, seeking comfort.

which brings up something i've always wondered about --

if the only way to heaven is through Jesus -- is that saying that the Aztec's, Egyptian's, Mayan's, Chinese, Indians, Iraqians, etc etc -- didn't/won't go to heaven when they died/die ???

they believed in their God -- they were good people that raised their families to worship and love and respect -- what about all the tribes in the jungles that have never heard of our christian God ??

it would seem to me that someone believing that only THEIR way is "THE" way is standing in judgement of others --- is feeling superior to others ---

my God is a loving and kind and forgiving God -- he doesnt judge by religion -- I don't think he cares about your "religion" -- he welcomes all who have good hearts -- who love their fellow man -- tries to raise their children to be good people --feels true sorrow when they've done something that they shouldnt have (when they've been "human")

i also believe that the bible is the greatest history book ever written -- but it has been changed and re-written many times to fit the whims (and power) of Kings and priests through the ages --

i try to live by the ten commandments and the golden rule and if i can accomplish that - i believe my God will be content with me

and yes Songbird - i think we go to heaven when we die -- it just might take a few trips before we get to stay there ;-)

Good question, Lionspaaw, and I guess that's what I mean, and who I have in mind when I suspect that God wears many faces and allows Himself to be called many names.

We here in North America often assume without even a second thought that when God made us in His image, He made us "white-skinned"...but at the time that Scripture was written, I doubt that anyone had ever seen a white-skinned person before...everyone at that time probably would have been black or olive-skinned, and yet we in North America rarely think of God looking anything but "white-skinned" and tend to expect everyone else to perceive His image the same way we do. But if we're ALL made in His image, and some of us are black-skinned, olive-skinned, red-skinned, yellow-skinned, then we have to acknowledge that He must be so much more multi-faceted and creative than we can imagine.

I think that religion or adherance to any one set of religious tenets cannot possibly be the sole basis for every single person's relationship with God...it might be for ME, but I can't presume to judge that it's the same and only choice for every other human being on earth. This thing with God, it has to be more of a heart connection, a soul connection that transcends all these human limitations. Otherwise our insistence that there is one and only one way to God automatically leaves out far too many of our other brothers and sisters all over the world, and I don't think that could ever be a loving Father's intent. But that's just my humble take on it.

Smile:
One of this forum’s greatest advantages is that we can all share our different views. And I’m sure we can benefit from these discussions. I understand it can get confusing to read so many different views. When you wonder what of all you hear or read to believe, pray for the Holy Spirit to guide you as you study the Word of God. I believe it’s the safest way to go.

Eagle:
In the Bible we find many names for Jesus/God. I understand that God, in his infinite love for mankind, wants us to be able to relate with him in the different aspects of our lives. The good shepherd, the light of the world, the father, the Way, the Life, etc.; each name conveys us different aspects of His love and care for us; each name will minister to us in different situations too.

He came to be among us, sinners, he took the humiliation, the criticism, the pain, the agony that separation from His father caused by the burden of sins he bore, to show us how to live and love; love Him and our fellow men. And that is the core of his message: LOVE. He even instructed us to love our enemies. What’s great about his message is that he not only tells us to, he showed us how to. Isn’t it a blessing to have such a loving God?

Posted by Danita: “God’s love doesn’t demand a change, it produces a change!”

Danita: I agree with you. When we prayerfully consider the depth of His love and his teachings, we can’t be the same. His way, his love, all he went through to show mankind HIS LOVE for us… once you get to know him personally, you can never be the same. When you KNOW him you’re moved to love him. Once you love him, you’re moved by his love to serve him.

Lionspaaw:
I respect your view on the subject of death/heaven.
About your question regarding others who never had the opportunity to learn about God, I believe they are judged by their faithfulness to what they knew/learned. I believe it is contrary to God’s loving character to judge someone otherwise.

May God bless each one as we try to dig deep into His Word, and learn to love each other regardless of our different opinions.

Lion, when Ross and I were doing youth ministry we had a Catholic priest, rabbi and Presbyterian minister talk about their beliefs. It was so much fun to have such diversity in the room. I believe forums like that and forums like this stretch our minds, make us ask questions, and seek God's will individually. This is vital for growth to take place.

Someone asked the Presbterian minister your very same question. (I loved working with youth because they put it all out there. Inhibitions hadn't settled within yet.) Anyway, his response was the same as songs. How can one be judged if they haven't had the opportunity to hear?

Eagle mentioned being worn out by living her life by the book. That was the faith of my youth. I obeyed because I was scared. Now I take great pleasure in trying to live by Christ's example. It feels so much better.

Thanks to everyone for sharing such intimacies.

"So we all love that which we consider holy. But you must be aware that your God's "news" is not the intended holy path for all others; your message is not necessarily mine. Most of us can share and discuss our beliefs without proselytizing, but I believe you've crossed the line."
---
I'm not trying to convert anyone. The purpose of my joining this forum/website was because I thought it was Christian based. I did not realize their were others with different beliefs in other religions. But I will stand firm on my words and have noticed that I've offended others because of what I've presented from the bible. Why I was singled out from my quote, I have no idea, when others on this forum carry the same beliefs (beliefs in Jesus Christ). I had assumed everyone in this forum belived in the same God.

Danita: "Praise HIM in this place!"

I agree!

I could go on and on to answer the questions here, like "what about the others who do not know Jesus" or "others who have beliefs in other religions and worship those Gods but are good people" and "he doesn't judge by religion" If this is a Christian forum/website, I believe the answer has already been provided.

If you would like to contact me to discuss offline, I would be happy to. But this will be my last post.

Thanks to those who stood firm in the word and didn't compromise their Christian beliefs.

I have experienced this forum, not as a Christian forum, but as a loving place where faith is supported in whatever form it is practiced. I would hope that no one feels singled out or unaccepted for standing on their faith, but that all faiths are equally accepted.

The point of the boomer forum is not to convince, but to share. Posting from the heart is encouraged and differing viewpoints are respected. No one opinion is more valid than the other.

I have enjoyed reading the posts about what happens after death. It seems to be a very impassioned and important subject as we enter the second half of life.

smile

[ July 07, 2005, 02:37 PM: Message edited by: smilinize ]

Eagleheart
Your beauty is unparallel. God is love. Within that is everything. All sin...all pain...all thoughts of fear....gone,never to be judged, for they vanish in the light of love. To return to the light at the end of our journey is love. Love never changes!

To all the rest of you lovely ladies....may the light of love forever rest in your hearts revealing your beauty and forever bringing you peace!

The light remains within everyone...the steps we take revealing pain, which is just the absence of light...but that core of light...that seed of light that birthed us will forever remain within, the light of the heart...that forever serves despite darkness...despite pain...despite diversity within religious convictions.

Perception is either the absence of light or the fullness of light and within that lies the reasons for wars and pain. Diversity of perception, the enemy to truth and yet the learning ground to understand the love and to become more of the light.

With love
Leigha