Judy,

I would love to get together to do an exercise.

I live in south central PA. 20 minutes east of Gettysburg, half hour from York, 20 minutes from Westminster, MD. I can stretch the travel if needed.

I have cried at work but not in front of the "boys". I always wondered what emotion I was feeling when I felt like crying. Think about it.

When I am angry at home I don't cry-I express my point (and probably make everyone else want to cry). I am not easily pushed over so it would take a pretty strong force for me to quake in my boots.

The emotion must be frustration from not being able to say what I need to or of what could happen to me re: my job and how badly I needed or wanted it.

Do you think that sometimes the tears come from the woman's inate need to want to please?

My ex-boss would yell and humiliate so I knew that most women there reacted to that type of communication.

Dynamics are fascinating aren't they?

Lynn

I had a feeling this would be a hot topic. Ladies, please visit the home page of bws and see thier photo. Also, you can click through to Amazon and buy their book. You will feel like you are among friends while reading it.

Hi Judy. I am just past my one year anniversary of leaving corporate America (20 year veteran)and no one could have prepared me for the emotional rollercoaster that I went through. Do you address that issue in your book and at your seminars?

Jersey Girl,

Yes, some of us went through emotions and frustrations when we left work and that is addressed in the book.

Judy

Hi from Judy

Rather than send out the list of do’s and don’ts I created for myself over time, why don’t we take them one at a time and discuss our different views. I’ll use my own experiences to tell why these mottos are important to me. You can use yours and tell about any mottos you have. Here’s the one I regret that I didn’t do better. SPEAK WITH GRACE AND AUTHORITY. I was reminded of this one when the NineWomen recently visited Franklin Roosevelt’s home in Hyde Park. Our guide told us that it was Roosevelt’s mother who taught him how to use words well. Parts of his speeches are still remembered, like the “day of infamy” speech. Personally, I was pretty good about thinking through how I’d say something before speaking up at a meeting. But I wasn’t the best at getting up in front of a large audience. I think both my career and my feelings about myself would have been better if I’d been more effective at that, and if I had it to do all over again, I would have worked with a professional coach. Of course, what you say is more important than how you say it, but if you don’t express your ideas well, they don’t get heard and remembered.

Judy

And this is so important for women in the corporate world. Do you believe we are heard differently than men?

Just thought I'd share that I am reading 30 Days To Taming Your Tongue, by Deborah Smith Pegues. For about the past 15 years I have really been interestedin using our speech to encourage one antoher and build each other up. It's tough to watch every word that comes out of our mouths. Just like toothpast, once it's out, it can't go back in the tube. Anyway, I saw this book in CVS while waiting my turn and decided to pick it up. It is faith based, and so far, so good!

I have lots of toopics to discuss you you Judy. I hope we can get to all of them. The whole notion of our generation storming the work force is so interesting to me. I have good and bad feeling about it which I hope we'll get to.

Hi all
(This is Kathy from the ninewomen group.)
I'd like to add a couple of thoughts after reading all the posts.

I have been thinking about the "unwritten rules". The challenge of working in corporate America for me was that there wasn't any published rulebook, but it was a "learn as you go" way of operating.
I can remember that it took me a while to learn and figure out what was expected and I always felt like I was on the outside and I was guessing. I always felt at a disadvantage because I was sure that all the guys knew the rules and they left the women to guess. (This probably wasn't true, since there were a lot of men in the dark too, but it sure felt that way at times)

One of my first bosses, privately explained to me to dress like a "professional" if I wanted to be treated seriously.

At one point in my career (in my late thirites) I was adopted by a couple of guys who were in their middle to late forties. They decided to teach myself and another younger woman the ways of business. They thought we were smart but, they told us that we would never be successful unless they took us under their wing, because of what we didn't know. They became our friends and clued us in to such things as--is it okay to "drink" at business functions, what the expected dress was of the dreaded business casual, what do you do when you are caught in a politic battle between two warring bosses, how to "game' your boss into a good evaluation and a lot more. They shared with us the secrets of the good old boy's network so that we would know who was on the fast track and who wasn't and told us "stories" about our bosses. They even taught us how to play poker and the importance of a poker face. I really missed them when they took early retirement in their early 50's.

Even their advice wasn't sufficient to feel like I knew the "rules". I always felt like an outsider and I discovered after joining NineWomen that all the other women felt like outsiders too.

Kathy

Hi Evie, (from Kathy of NineWomen)

I wanted to talk about the dreams we have in our post-corporate lives-

There are nine of us and each of us has our own hopes and dreams. As a matter of fact one of the exercises we designed for our first workshop was called "Worries, Hopes and Dreams"

Many of us desire to feed our creative sides after so many years of managing people and being results-oriented. For example, Judy's interest is in writing and Fran's in botantical art.

The year I stopped working, I was ecstatic just not to hear an alarm clock, wear pantyhose, travel on airplanes, and happy to exercise regularly and eat well. (Modest dreams, right?)

But now I am exploring photography, starting to take jewelry classes am interested in creativity and how it works and use my volunteer position at the local library to create positive pr for them. I, like many of the other NineWomen, want to do something different from what I did for 30 years and I enjoy that we (NineWomen) push ourselves to try new and different and sometimes scary things.

Kathy

Lynn,

Getting back to you about the exercises. Please respond to NineWomen@att.net. That's the address we give in our book. The question is could you get together a group of women to do the exercises? At least 8, more if possible.

Judy

Dear NineWomen,
Here is a little joke, leading to a question I have. Please indulge me.

A man joined a big Multi National Company as a trainee. On his first day, he dialed the kitchen and shouted into the phone: "Get me a cup of
coffee, quickly!"

The voice from the other side responded: "You fool, you've dialed the wrong extension! Do you know who you're talking to?"

"No" replied the trainee.

"It's the Managing Director of the company, you idiot!"

The trainee shouted back: "And do you know who YOU are talking to, you IDIOT?"

"No!" replied the Managing Director angrily.

"Thank God!" replied the trainee and put down the phone.

Here's my question: Did any of you ever find yourself in a situation that was UNrecoverble? (Is that a word?)... in other words, when each of you left the corporate world, was it by your own choice? Or were any of you faced with a situation that you felt forced you out? And if so, how did it make you feel?

Thanks in advance,

JJ

JJ