This is a good discussion. This kind of openness and honesty is what I sought when I posted this thread. I believe it is what we need if we are to keep our country as wonderful as it is.

Current stuff on the matter. It includes the resolution congress passed on Sept 14, 2001:

quote:
On Capitol Hill, the White House proposed a resolution that would give the president authority to "deter and prevent any related future acts of terrorism and aggression against the United States." Members from both parties objected that the language was too broad.

"It would have given him authority to do anything he wanted, anytime, anywhere," recalls Rep. Peter DeFazio (news, bio, voting record), D-Ore. The wording was revised.

The new version said: "The President is authorized to use all necessary and appropriate force against those nations, organizations, or persons he determines planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on Sept. 11, 2001, or harbored such organizations or persons."
It almost sounds like we gave him the authority and power to get away with the illegal eavesdropping. However, Barbara Boxer clarifies it well with her statement:

quote:
"There's nothing in there that gave the president the authority to override the law," says Sen. Barbara Boxer (news, bio, voting record), D-Calif. She has asked four legal scholars if they believe Bush has admitted an "impeachable offense."
You can find the details on the above in the following article:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/usatoday/20051221/ts_usatoday/skepticismtrailsbushsdefenseofdomesticspying


And this next one's got a pro and con attitude - a judge resigns because of it, and Senate Intelligence Committee Chairman Pat Roberts, a Kansas Republican, pushes back (with what I think is an iffy argument (considering, on the whole, this is supposed to be super top secret.)

Report: Spy court judge quits in protest
http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/12/21/spyjudge.resigns.ap/index.html

And here's a sidebar about the Patriot Act - it's good to see that the Senate is taking this thing seriously.

Bush condemns filibuster on Patriot Act renewal
http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/12/21/patriot.act/index.html


And then we have the bipartison request for a probe into the Bush/Cheney assertion that it was all legal.
Bipartisan call for wiretapping probe
http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/12/20/wiretaps/index.html

quote:
Cheney said such measures were necessary because the United States needed to "aggressively go after terrorists" and that they had "saved thousands of lives."

"It is, I'm convinced, one of the reasons we haven't been attacked in the past four years," Cheney said.
Of course, he was also convinced that Iraq had WMDs!

A particularly interesting statement:

quote:
"For the last few days, I have witnessed the president, the vice president, the secretary of state and the attorney general repeatedly misrepresent the facts," Rockefeller said in a written statement.
Addtional interesting comments:

quote:
Another lawmaker who knew about the program, House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, asked National Intelligence Director John Negroponte Tuesday to declassify a letter she wrote to the administration years ago expressing her "strong concerns," as well as the White House response.

Sen. Barbara Boxer, a California Democrat, discounted the administration's contention that the program was necessary to ensure a swifter response than the FISA court would allow.

"That's why our law allows a president to go right away and apply for those warrants retroactively within 72 hours," she told CNN.

Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean went so far as to compare the program to "the dark days of President Nixon."
We (the people) are Americans above all else. We come in all shapes, sizes and persuasions - religious, agnostic, atheist; women and men; Republicans, Democrats, Independents, what have you. Regardless of our persuasion - and how the world now views us - we are indeed a nation of rightness and goodness. The key truth to that rightness and goodness, however, is not in blindly supporting a President who is wrong and deceitful, but in standing together, as a nation of people, and supporting the country that the President is sworn to protect. The President is not our nation; we the people are that nation. The President is but one of us whom we have chosen(?) to represent all of us. We must never succumb to blind faith in anyone, for blind faith, either believing everything or doubting everything, are two equally convenient solutions, both of which dispense with the necessity for reflection - democracy is the free exercise of that reflection.

[ December 22, 2005, 03:59 AM: Message edited by: Vi ]