oh . . . as for why homosexuals of either gender might prefer younger "specimens," as well . . . i think an argument could be made for the same hard-wiring for virility or fertility. the organism would not necessarily have to know that it would be futile. in fact, the same argument could be held for infertile couples . . . the desire to mate with a virile/fertile specimen would be the same in all cases.

that is my theory and i am sticking to it until i don't

Seek, I can acknowledge the fact that yes, study has proven that the dark male is a sign of fertility and attracts women. I have read those studies and know personally that it is true with my relatives who are all tall and dark haired.

I was only saying that society puts the "type," in the minds of women later and pushes them to the "white horse," type and that man is usually blond and tall. Yes, we may be thinking deeply that "I want one of those tall, dark men," but to please our parents, and in every culture or most, the aim is to marry the "light," man, the light skinned black, the wider eyed Asian, the more Americanized the better. Would you agree on that? I know many black women who want "light babies," and rejoice if they have one.
Even the Hispanic culture has gotten into this trend when they advise their daughters to marry a light skined Hispanic man, preferably with an education and light colored eyes.
It's just survival of the fittest to people to think that if they mainstream their family closer to the American Ideal, (remember the color of the original Barbie and Ken doll,) they will be more successful. There are many races who come here to marry a "white," man and the lighter the better. The military is proof of that and can verify their popularity over in other countries! They are even trained to fight off the advances of these women of other countries who try to "trap," the American man into marriage. My husband, 20 years for the government has told me of the lectures they recieve before they hit port.

so, I agree that the basic instinct is there but the social push is for the other side, the lighter side. Even Obama is light skinned and mixed.

Dancer

oh, you are talking about survival strategies. yes, i would agree that one can consciously choose a survival strategy.

do you mean the organisum or climax to the storie lol just wondering if that was a typo, it made school biologie hell for me lol.

id agree at a level homosexuales and hetrosexuales being people first and formost would perhapps being subcouncislie be looking for "fitness of type" instead of just the slang fitness, i was just looking out the window watching the world wiggle by when i thought of that one :), kinda put the idea in my head.

that example i gave of my last few weeks being pregnant was the strongest primal drive id ever felt, thank god i had sence not to follow that drive their be a few decapitasions. (looking back i might have saved myself a lot of trouble, i say this as a pure pacefist first and foremost. lol.

yeah, i meant organism. but cute pun.

the pregnancy thing: omg! talk about "biology as destiny." wow.

dancer, just in relashion to what you weer saying regarding the drive to marry and breed light skined kids well a wee bit of trivia, heer in uk a couple 100 years ago it was also the same drive to marry very white people, rember heer men and women dusted their faces with powder (to hide pox marks and becouse one of the queens was a red haired, so vvery pale,

i think it cought on within societie as a whole heer becouse it showed ones class, if your pale your ceertinlie not a labourer in the filds getting a tan so linked paleness with class. bizzare eh.
no i coul't give you what descovery channel programme i learned that from or bit of litriture i read that informed me of it.

would their be any similare type of assosiasion within your lands (in not calling ya americans anymore as many of you aint, so your land it is )

interesting, celtic. not to interrupt . . . i hope dancer does respond. but i have read of the class distinctions between dark and light people . . . working in the fields, versus getting a sun tan, deliberately, which is a twist on the class/leisure
connection.

in rapp, which i do listen to, its much changed thse days, maybee not so hard core anymore but certinlie cleaver with words anyway. (i read that chat which is mostlie black simgers not all but mostlie and with mostlie but not all manie of the black singers many have very white feature or as you put it the white skined black with tradisonal white type features. I was watching tmf and music 4 which is all song and video and was thinking the same type of thought regarding the artists as this chat has me thinking generallie as what dancers expressing.

I was wonderring how toleraant we had all become (sarcasum) when the favoured black artists are mixed race or so it appeares skin tone and facial trates being considered.

I not a sepritist by any means, in case thats how that coment came across.

what surprises me is all races or ethnicities being pushing their kids to lean towards more lighter more non race spacific looking types.
In the other hand if it gives the kids an easier passage through life then i can see why and how it happen.

i am really conflicted about "integration" and "separatism." since i am a second generation american, i feel so sad that my father HAD to assimilate for survival's sake and ALL of the cultural traditions were lost (nothing was consciously passed down). i have coveted the families in new york who were able to keep their heritage and often think about the special neighborhoods in new york. i really love it when the cultures stay intact.

i also love the china town of san francisco and like to get lost in it. i also became very upset to learn the history of a couple of other china towns that were completely wiped out, due to racism. it hurts me because i value the history and am pissed that this was allowed to happen and that no one in the dominant culture tried to stop it. i really infuriates me.

and on the other hand, it is supposed to be "bad" to be separate, as in apartied. i think the discrimination part of that, without question, is bad, but i don't think separation, in terms of keeping a culture intact is bad. but that brings us to the middle east where each culture is vying for the same stinking piece of land. sorry if that is irreverent, but i doubt there is much holy left to that land. the people have desecrated it, as far as i am concerned.

I saw a scarrie programe over heer studie kids over time. It was called a child of the mellenium or melenium child they been followin the kids from the year 2000.

it found: white children by the age of 3, yep 3 when showen pictures of straight dowen the line white kids, were seen as more atractive, inteligent and had attributed more positive personalitie caricteristicks than any other kids of no white origine. asian, black italion or spanish.

more disturbinlie it also found this same pattern amoungst the "non white" children.

racisum or sterotypical biase within any child at that age is a shock, more so when kids looking at kids that look like them also found the same biases not for but agenst the kids that looked the same as them.

i just rember that when reading what dancer said. This programe is a few years old. i was hoping that this treand would somehow reverse itself as the child aged. If not from dominent culture at lest from kids within the non dominent cultures.

I think as orchid was describing earlier about a pride and wanting to research the genetick roots a familie came from.

I wonder if this is a stronger drive amost the minoritie eethinicities within a culture than it is within the dominent culture. Just becouse the domint culture never had to face the "your not from heer" conversasion or more sutler attitude.

Anyone know?