DD, I'm with you. I avoid confrontation, arguments, and negative communication at all costs. That's why it's often hard for me to weigh in on some of the political debates. I'd rather run the other way, and keep my opinion to myself.

orchid, thanks for sharing what your other forum is like. I find it interesting that the founder is hardly there. Does she have forum moderators?

dancer, typically, the tough things have been discussed, but they have been personal and others have offered and felt tremendous support.

Lately, and due to the election, tough topics were discussed, but they were debated because there was always an opposing opinion where people were trying to prove their point. This is very different from discussing a personal issue that isn't related to politics.

I think part of the problem (for some of us gentler folk) is that there always used to be room for both the tea parties and the spirited debates - and everything in-between. The problem some of us are struggling with now is that the spirited sparring has a louder voice that can (and does) easily dominate, squelch and drown out the gentler voices among us. A subtle-but-deadly hostility has begun leaking out of the sparring forums into some of the other threads where the non-sparring tea-party people enjoy connecting, encouraging and spending comfortable time with each other on a gentler level, without the combative sparring. Such pleasant chit-chat on a heart-to-heart level used to be the mainstay of this community in the past but has become almost impossible now. If sparring and spirited debate is the only facet that is now going to be nurtured and allowed full freedom here, then we WILL (it's already happening) lose the gentler voices that have brought so much life, wisdom and healing to this community.

I still think there's room for both, but those who enjoy and thrive on spirited sparring will have to respect the safer gentler ground that others try to create within other forums here and those who enjoy the gentler approach might want to steer clear of those hot topics.

Eagle, I agree. I will watch the forums (that really aren't for debating) very closely to make sure this debate and prove your point attitude doesn't prevail. Big sigh...

I like the use of "gentler" Eagle.
NEVER to be confused with being weak...indeed it is a
gift.Channeled the gentle person has endurance.

During times of troubles and worries having access to the forum was a blessing for me...special friendships were forged.
those ladies know who they are...Lola are you reading?

We all view dialogue from our own perspective and make conclusions based on our own life experience and intuition.

To be congregant and authentic is my journey and sparring I leave for those who are still undecided on their path..
For a time I thought all was lost for me here but now the topic has been aired...tell me friends..how do we go forward?
Mountain ash

I'll be honest - want that?
It's not the discussions that bother me. The more debatable the topic, the better I like it.
What I don't like is the one-upmanship which seemed to have raised its head. No matter what some of us had to say, it felt as if it was either cut down, put in a position to be disproved with antagonistic and out right "you don't know what to think, know where to read, or understand what truth is." Honestly, it was the approach that caused me to hurt, not the thoughts, ideas and interpretations of events.
Don't you agree a point can be made 'gentler' by adding a few words?
Example:
Subjective and harsh: All short fat women stink.
Still subjective, but 'gentler': It seems to me that all short women stink. or maybe, Doesn't it seem that all short women stink?
On several accounts, some of us were made to feel as if we were as if we were suppose to praise our oppositions' posts and accept them as indisputable. But, yet, besides the composition (high level as it might have been), holes could be shot through and throughout the posts' contents. Some of us didn't respond, trying to stop, or at least temper, some of the friction. Then after awhile, we'd come back to test the waters (so to speak) because we thought we had valid input, and lo and behold, it seemed to start up again.

There is no one [earthly] truth... I think we can all agree. We all have different truths.
As for my personal truths, you can try and re-color them if you'd like, but don't come at me as if your truth trumps mine.

DD, I so appreciate you starting this thread. It has been a long-time-needed. I was to a point of leaving... my voice constantly being challenged by a select few. I consider myself one of the low to no conflict members... but when I see another being fired at, I tend to want to step in front of the bullet. I can get firy, too... as well as the next, but it is most often after I've reached the adequately termed 'tipping point.'

There seems to be a piece of some of us that thrives on friction. I consider them much like my ADHD grandson. For his brain to stay calm, he has to be in the middle of chaos, so he starts it. His calm then feeds off of the chaos... it sounds strange, but his brain (with the release of the needed chemicals) then functions more calmly. It appears this might be happening with some contributors @ BWS.

As I've expressed to several of the gals, here, I love some of you like sisters. It's nice having sisters... esp. ones of good character and with loving hearts.

On the other forum, I checked out the different topic areas for us to choose...I could not find any specific people assigned to moderate.

Politics as a topic there, is kept to a minimum...the regular women participants will call out a stop, if the discussion gets overly hot. which is a GREAT contrast when I participated in a different, but co-ed Internet cycling forum for 3 years. Then I left because I got so tired of painted as a liberal ready to destroy the world's moral fibre..or whatever. Sparring with guys on that Internet forum, required a healthy dose of humour and distance...not to get overwrought or take things too personally.

There were times here where I felt compelled to say something because it felt so fundamentally wrong to me..ie. hand gun ownership (which is illegal in Canada and cannot be concealed even if you got a permit.) but because the majority of this forum are Americans..it's just tough for a significant vocal group to believe that life can go on without a gun when you live in areas where there are other people of whom the majority have no interest in hurting you (though some might steal, still that doesn't justify a gunshot). Compared to living in areas where there are polar bears, etc.

Sorry..am mixing hot topic here. (Now that I've said this much, does that surprise you when I've lived in drug-dealing areas of a major city?)

I don't expect Dotsie to solve problems when other forum members don't agree with me or if I feel hurt/ angered at the changes in forum tone. I'm not even sure it's worth my time to bother her with personal emails if the debates /topics get too hot. I just drop out of the forums for awhile.

It's not the occasional hurting that's the problem, though. The problem that some of us are trying to address in this thread is the ever-increasing undercurrent of antagonism and hostile-toned challenging of opinions and perspectives outside of the emotionally-charged topics such as politics. That DOES require attention and resolution if we want to keep the gentler voices here. I'm tired of being squashed, and I haven't been nearly as squashed or slammed as others who have gradually quietly slipped away because it's simply not safe for them to participate anymore.

There would not be such a problem if the sparring could be confined to select forums, but when the antagonistic challenging of personal perspectives leak out into other threads, it's just not a fun place to be anymore. I don't want to have to drop out of the forums...this is my home-away-from-home and has been for many years now. I'm committed and passionate about this community.

Let me reiterate that I believe that there's room for everyone, and for diversity of thought and discussion...the problem is that lately there has NOT been room for the gentler folk anywhere, even in the forums and threads that, by nature of the topics discussed, have tended in the past to be gentler in tone and approach. Some of us just want that safe space and freedom to be gentle without fear of being attacked, challenged and even ridiculed for wanting to be gentle!

I wish to post to Eagle Heart with whom I used to have a mutual "like," I believe.

Eagle heart, you are a sensitive woman with a voice that is heard, and should be heard. Your caring and gentle ways are something I respect and I wanted you to know.

At times I become spirited, yes, but I like to think I have a good heart in regard to how others feel.

I miss your posts, Eagle Heart and I'm sure that others do. You have a unique voice and one that, again, deserves to be heard. I feel badly that you feel you cannot post. There are times I am so sensitive that I cannot abide something touching my skin, those are times when my pain gets the better of me. There are also times when I am feeling, in my real life, very sad, or very sensitive and when those come, I don't post on the forum.

I do not post when those hard times come for me because of the reactions I have had when I've tried to explain my pain.

If you are feeling that way, I'm sorry. Again, I love your posts and you are a gentle and wise soul.

I hope you will post more and be yourself as you have in the past and were ONE voice that felt for me in my pain when I did open up and post. I will not forget your feedback and your gentle support.

Because you were there when I was truly out of sorts I always remember you as a kind woman, and again, wise in ways of the heart.

I wanted to address you, in open forum, Eagle Heart and say "thank you," for being you when you post.

Dancer

Thank you Dancer for your kind words.

I like to think that I bring something good to the table here. My passion for this community comes out of knowing all too well that I might not even be here (alive) had it not been for this place and these women. Who would I be without all of the wisdom, caring, kindness, prayer and light that so many women through the years have poured into my heart and soul? There is no way that anyone here can possibly imagine just how life-giving and life-changing BWS has been for me. I just want BWS to continue to be here for others who come here broken, wounded and lonely and in need of a safe place to gather, connect and evolve through the kind wisdom of this community of awesome women. We are so much more than our individual perspectives - we are so much more together than any of us can be alone - and we are so much more powerful together, united in our diversity and evolved through our collective wisdom, than any of us can possibly imagine. We have no idea of the ripple effect of our crossing paths and spending time here with each other. There is infinitely more going on - here and because of here - than any of us can comprehend.

I need to be here. I need other women to be here with me. Many of us need each other, in various capacities and for various reasons, even if only to feel needed. I love the person I've become through spending time here and I love how the wisdom that's been shared here has evolved and helped shape me into a wiser woman and a kinder human being.

We need BWS to continue to be a safe place for everyone who stumbles in here...this is a wonderful, powerful sanctuary for wise voices...it's no accident that we are here.

Eagle..there is alot to what you wrote. I think there should be space for heated debate..but it shouldn´t spill over..or take over..the forum.

My family..and therefore I myself, am going thru hell on earth and true pain right now..but I found no fertile soil to plant my tiny seeds of thought which would then, usually in the past, be watered and cared for by you ladies here..and give me comfort and direction and strength to go on and find my path toward the sunlight.

I have nothing against heated debates,..but I would like to be able to go some places here on the forum..and breathe freely..cry a little with my friends here and be uplifted by the wisdom and humor I know is here or simply just "talk" about my day or someone´else´s day..and share together.

I am not ALL that interested in politics.. (crazy right?..but true..too much else going on..and the election is over now)..but it´s ok with me if the subject is treated here and/or other controversial topics..just leave room for the rest of life,too. Life has so many facets..so VERY many facets!!! Let us be able to breathe..ponder together..ask for help, if we need to.. and allow this to fall on gentle, loving and compassionate ground sprinkled with some humor somewhere on the forum

Thank you for this thread..this was interesting..hopeful

Hugs!