I think some people think I am TOO open to other religions and systems of belief! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Certainly I have come into contact with people of other cultures and religions over the years who I admire and respect.It is the expansion and growth of my understanding of God that is the point of conflict with my former (it hurts to say that) fellowship group.

I am not shopping for a new God - I have been claimed by the great I AM, saturated in the loving forgiveness of Jesus Christ and comforted daily by the Holy Spirit. He meets me on the beach where the waves meet the sand gives me songs to sing each morning.

I am just in mourning for the lost fellowship of friends who are stuck on the details of theology and can't admit the great encompassing love of God.

Of course it hurts. I am sorry for your loss of friends from the fellowship, but as Garrie intimated, that may be your old raft.

I know you trust in your God and the universe. Trust too that God/ Universe will bring you to the people you need to know for the coming journey.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Julie:
<strong>- I have been claimed by the great I AM, saturated in the loving forgiveness of Jesus Christ and comforted daily by the Holy Spirit. He meets me on the beach where the waves meet the sand gives me songs to sing each morning. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Beautifully written...I love that <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Julie, I've been mulling your post over for days because I've been (and am still sorta floundering) in a very similar situation with my church family.

Reflecting on when this started (several years ago) I was employed by my church. After three years of serving as the part-time Coordinator of Member Care, I chose to leave. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Yeah, try leaving a job in a church where you are, and have been a member for years. I did so as diplomatically as possible.

Our church has been in transition/turmoil for several years and I've witnessed behaviors that franklly shocked me (yet were done in the name of God). Go figure... who am I to judge?

Here's how I've managed to stay above water.

I hunkered down in prayer at my kitchen table with my Bible, journal and any other Christian book I may have been reading at the time. I poured out my soul to my good buddy, Jesus Christ.

I clung to my prayer group who I saw as faithful women.

I was very picky about my involvement at the church, choosing to stay involved with the children because they are so innocent.

I sought spiritual growth outside my own church and found it in other places, and still do.

We continued to go to church as a family because my children and spouse were involved in some areas.

Many dear friends have moved on and we're still hanging in there and healing.

I've had differing emotions about the whole situation. There are times when I'm upset that people have left or are leaving, and there are times when I question why I'm still hanging out.

The most important thing I can tell you is this: In spite of all the turmoil at the church, my faith has grown tremendously because in some ways I've had to go it alone. Hasn't been such a bad thing.

So dear friend, I hope this helps. I'm happy to chat more through e-mail if you would like.

I'm glad your heart is in it and it's important enough that you chose to throw it out to your online neighbors. Sending thoughts and prayers your way.

Oh, we have a new minister who is giving me great hope for positive changes. Yahoo!

It's interesting what Julie is saying about missing the fellowship with others who you think share your beliefs. How do you really know if others believe the same as you do anyway? So few people talk about it. There's some sort of taboo about talking about beliefs. And we often use words, many which are never examined. For example, somewhere in the forum, someone said she doesn't believe in God, if you mean the God that looks like what Michaelangelo painted on the Sistine Chapel. What's funny about that is that she assumed that's what others meant by "God". I think that many who say they're atheist say so for the same reason -- because they saw pictures in their childhood of "god" which they know as adults to be an absurdity.
How do you know when you're really close to someone? Is it because of the words you share in common with people you only see in church? Or do you really have a community of caring, from people you can count on when you need help, physically and otherwise?

Connections are so important in life, whoever they are with, regardless of where those connections are made.

Whatever the connection is to another person, it is made because of commonalities. Anytime I feel misconnected or unconnected to someone that I thought I had lots in common with, I feel a little out of whack. Curious about why the misconnection. It's usually a time of growth.

It's a shame we let religious politics get in the way of relationships. I think relationships are more important than rules and government.

DJ, there was a time when I picked and chose who I talked about my beliefs with, but the older I get the more I'm willing to take the occasional risk and share my faith. It's not easy and is usually very calculated, but if people hadn't shared their faith with me, I wouldn't have the faith that I have today....so I say go for it and talk about what people may not want to hear.

If it is believable I agree with all of you.

Personally, I was raised a practising Catholic. Went kicking and screaming most of the time. But a voice or a message was getting through even then. I always listen to that voice. It guides even through some crazy turns and twists in my life.

I have learned to have faith and believe in that voice. I believe it is God. The voice told me to leave town when I was 19 and not to marry the man I was engaged to. An opportunity presented itself (and it was outlandish) and I took it. I met not only myself over the next 10 years but my husband and love of my life.

He, too, has been directed by the voice and believes to listen to God.

Most of our large life choices have been made by listening and taking the leap of faith.

Now that we are faced with Cancer recovery etc etc, my faith must be strong. I do believe He is the one that directed us into discovering a terminal disease that was caught early and is giving our little family a chance. Faith is an active verb!!

My after death beliefs get a little unconvential. I do believe I will see God and sit in front of him to be judged but not critically. Just to learn what I did and did not do inthis lifetime to further myself along the path. I do believe I will return to earth as another being that will have a road map laid out and a plan in place for my growth as a soul. The plan is deviated from because we all have our own will. I receive "roadsigns" that encourage me when I am on the path again and following God. When I deviate, and sometimes it has been years. I do not get a road sign. When I live withoput one for awhile, I know to begin to search within myself because I am on the wrong path.

I stopped there because this could get too lengthy. But the point is I am a believeer of God but I differ from the Catholic i was raised, in my afterlife beliefs. I accept everyones belief because each soul must do the work of their own in each life time. Who am I to say what is right for you?

I worship in a church sometimes and sometimes it is more meaningful to do for others or to simply be in God's lovely earth and appreciate him on a one to one basis. I deviate based on what I need.

Currently, group worship is what is needed and most soothing. So that is what we do.

Can we talk about faith here on earth without discussing the afterlife?

Okay, Dotsie, I will!
I grew up memorizing Bible passages -- the Beattitudes, Psalms, the 10 commandments -- maybe about a dozen or so -- in a Congregational church in the midwest. I was always puzzled about why God seemed actively involved in peoples' lives in those days, but hadn't been heard from recently. There was political infighting in my church, because the minister preached against Vietnam and started trying to integrate the church. People quit going and pledging, so the minister left. When he left, I left too, because I believed that as Christians we had to live our faith. After a few years of searching, I became a Baha'i and have been ever since.
From that perspective, let me respond to the most recent post, about hearing god's voice.
I don't believe that any of us is capable of talking directly to God. The only ones who can do that are the divine messengers, the revealers of Religion, who speak God's word throughout history, progressively revealing the message that people in that age are ready and able to hear. These divine teachers --separated by centuries but never absent (as promised to Noah) -- include Abraham, Moses, Zoroaster, Jesus, Buddha, Mohammad and Baha'u'llah, the founder of the Baha'i Faith. They bring teachings that can carry us forward, at a time when the "old raft" isn't able to.

DJ, how about educating us a little on the Baha'i Faith?

Sure.
Basically, the Baha'i Faith proclaims the unity of religion. God reveals His message to His chosen Messengers, and does so progressively throughout the ages. The divine Messengers receive a Revelation from God, but have to deliver their message according to the ability of people to comprehend. The spiritual truths are eternal -- all the religions have a Golden Rule.
But the social teachings change according to the needs of the times, as humankind has progressd from individuals and families to city states, nation states, and now the planet. Social teachings are things like dietary laws, marriage procedures, penalties for crimes (in the Old Testament it was an eye for an eye, for example).
The founder of the Baha'i Faith is Baha'u'llah whose name means Glory of God. He lived in Persia, and proclaimed the religion beginning in 1863. He was exiled for 40 years (because he was perceived by the Muslim clergy as a threat, so great was the power of his teachings) and ended up in prison in Akka, near Haifa, Israel, where the Baha'i world center is now.
Baha'u'llah revealed a number of different social laws, with the aim toward the unity of all people. One of the laws is a daily obligatory prayer. Another is a prohibition against backbiting. A Baha'i marriage requires the permission of all living parents and the reciting of a phrase before two witnesses.
There is no clergy in the Baha'i Faith. Instead, Baha'is elect assemblies of 9 members locally, nationally, and on a world level. The assemblies have authority, but the individual members do not. The elections occur by secret ballot, with no campaigning and no discussion of names. The 9 people with the most votes are elected.
The Baha'i calendar is 19 months of 19 days, with a few days left over. The year ends with a 19 day fast (Mar 2-20) between sunrise and sunset, then the new year begins on Mar 21. The first day of each month is the Feast, which is a meeting with 3 parts -- spiritual, business and social. The business part is where the community members all discuss their affairs. In some parts of the world, like India, where there are numerous Baha'is, they actually discuss things like running their schools, and getting drilling wells. There are sometimes centers, but no "churches" per se. It depends on the needs of any particular community. Around here we meet in each others' homes, though occasionally rent halls for bigger events.
However, Baha'is have built temples on all the continents of the world, to which all are invited to worship, though no formal services are held there. There's a temple near Chicago, Germany, Australia, Panama, Uganda, the South Pacific and one's being built in Chile.
Baha'u'llah wrote extensively on the reality of the soul. The soul begins at conception, in this world, and continues for eternity. The purpose of this life on earth is to acquire spiritual attributes that will be needed in the next world, such things as faith, truthfulness, patience -- all the virtues, in other words. The negative things are of the material world, and are like shadows that have no substance. Thus you can't take evil with you. However, you can determine the degree to which you progress spiritually.
Basically Baha'is view the diffences among religions as having mostly to do with differences in the social laws, which are inteneded to last only until the return of the next Luminary.
I hope this gives enough info for now!