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#9822 - 12/14/05 11:41 AM Whatever happened to integrity?
foundhervoice-atlast Offline
Member

Registered: 07/08/05
Posts: 80
Loc: Colorado
I just got off the phone with the soon-to-be-ex, and he was suddenly as sweet as molasses, which is a drastic change from his normal behavior towards me. I could not contain my shock and I asked him point blank why the change in his attitude. He said something about realizing how badly he had behaved in the past, and that since we would be interacting for many years to come because of our kids he might as well try to make things better between us. He then offered to give me two extra days with the kids this week as a gesture of goodwill. What he didn't know was that the kids already told me late last week that he was planning to be out of town for a one day job interview, and that he would like to extend his stay - assuming I would agree to take the kids for a few extra days - to visit with one of his long distance honeys. He has no idea that I or the children know about her or any of the other women he has been involved with since way before the marriage broke up.

I am incensed that he keeps feeding me this bull****! How stupid does he think I am? (No need to answer that, I already know...) [Eek!] I have my annual ob-gyn appointment this Friday and you better believe I am going to get tested. How could he be such a slime ball? I doted on him and took care of him for twenty years, and in return he could care less about having endangered my health. See what I mean? No integrity.

Do you think he'll ever get a clue? Is there something wrong with me for even asking this question? I have fully accepted that our 20 year marriage is over, and heaven knows I am finally convinced that it is all for the best. But I still keep hoping that he will start leveling with me, and be honest even if we are no longer together. Do you think there are any men out there who are honest and incapable of being liars and cheats when it suits them? Or am I just daydreaming? [Confused]

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#9823 - 12/14/05 06:18 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Daisygirl Offline
Member

Registered: 08/25/05
Posts: 1052
Loc: Ohio
Dear foundhervoice, I think you are smart to not let him know you're on to him. These sociopathic men know what to say to manipulate and if you realize what is going on, you're one step ahead of him. I think if he finds out before the divorce is final that you're on to him, it will be no holds barred on his part.

Guys like him never change, they just continue doing the same to other women. People have to make a huge effort to change and most can only do it with God's help.

There are some good men, but they are far and few between. Most of the good ones stay married.

Daisygirl

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#9824 - 12/15/05 12:19 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
foundhervoice, so what did you tell him when he asked if you would keep the kids?

I'd say you should keep the kids. They would probably rather be with you. I know that sounds harsh, but from what I've read, it's probably the truth.

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#9825 - 12/15/05 12:47 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
yepthatsme2 Offline
Member

Registered: 08/08/05
Posts: 816
Loc: Fredericksburg, Va.
There are good men out there...I happen to have one now...thank goodness.

But, I also know there are alot just like your soon-to-be ex. They never change..just go from woman to woman. Don't expect anything he can't give...like honesty. Really gets to you when they try and be sly, thinking they are pulling the wool over your eyes.
I'd let him know I knew what was going on, and ask him who was more important the kids, or his new friend.

Think my ex is on his 6th marriage now. His dad was married 8 times....do you think it runs in the family?

Hope your tests turn out fine.

[ December 14, 2005, 04:47 PM: Message edited by: yepthatsme2 ]

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#9826 - 12/15/05 05:14 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
chatty lady Offline
Writer

Registered: 02/24/04
Posts: 20267
Loc: Nevada
Most of the men like your soon to be ex and most of our ex's live by this mantra:

Don't Do What I Do, but Do Do What I Don't Do...

Think about it, thats the truth in a nut shell.

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#9827 - 12/15/05 05:27 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Dianne Offline
Queen of Shoes

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 6123
Loc: Arizona
I say, let him believe he's manipulating you until the divorce decree is signed. Then tell him how you feel.

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#9828 - 12/15/05 12:27 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
foundhervoice-atlast Offline
Member

Registered: 07/08/05
Posts: 80
Loc: Colorado
Thanks for your responses. It's really hard for me not to blurt out what I know about him when I see him. I've never been a good liar, or been able to hide my feelings (unless someone stood to get hurt), or behave in a devious manner. I used to think that that was a good thing, but now I'm thinking that I've been living in la-la land and need to shed my pollyanna ways.

I rehearse about a gazillion scenes of dialogue in my head every day, imagining myself saying cool, unemotional things to him that really knock him for a loop and take him completely by surprise. But I know that I probably couldn't pull it off in real life, because I'd get emotional and cry, or be too angry to come off as cool and uncaring. I'm afraid that if I zing him before the divorce negotiations are final by telling him what I know, he will get really angry out of embarassment and go on the attack like Daisy said.

I did agree to take the kids while he is away. My children have been my life for the past 17 years and I dedicated myself to raising them. Now that they are getting older they do have social lives of their own, and since we have only one car now and three drivers I wind up playing chauffeur a lot of the time. I don't see them as much as I'd like. Pre-divorce I would have taken this in stride but lately this often leaves me feeling somewhat abandoned and resentful, but I quickly remind myself that my job as a mom has always been to raise good, moral, sensitive, independent young men who are able to support themselves and give back to society. Not mama's boys. It's just that now that they are with me only 50% of the time I suddenly feel needy, and I miss them terribly.

On the weeks that they are staying with their father I turn the heat down low, unplug every unnecessary light and appliance, and scrimp and save to conserve funds (I never know from one day to the next where money will come from since he is conveniently unemployed and refusing to pay any kind of support) But I think that being clingy and demanding of my sons would be one of the biggest mistakes I could make right now, so I put a smile on my face and try not to show them how terribly this all hurts.

Dotsie - the kids do prefer to be at home with me, but the older one feels bad for his dad even though he is very angry with him, and he has become obsessed with being fair. To him this means making sure he does not behave in a way that expresses favor toward one parent or the other. He is still very angry with both of us for derailing his life and trying to keep control of his emotions. He has a much harder time adjusting to the weekly change in houses than my younger one does, who is much more people savvy than his older brother and realized from the git go that his father is not an honest or nice man and is trying to make up for years of neglect by buying his love and promising him material things.

I am glad that some of you have found good men. That gives me hope for the male gender, especially as the mother of two boys.

After reading your replies I'm going to try to keep my mouth shut and wait until I am in a better position financially and emotionally before I let the cat out of the bag and tell the jerk what I found out about his deceitful behavior and secret plans. I just hope I can do it...Wish me luck on my tests Friday...

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#9829 - 12/15/05 05:46 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
chatty lady Offline
Writer

Registered: 02/24/04
Posts: 20267
Loc: Nevada
Luck to you on friday FHVAL...
Here are some interesting published Baby Boomer statistics from MetLife Mature Market Institute 2005 (ages 41-59)

Marriage/Divorce

3.9% of those 65 and over have never been married....

12.6% of Boomers have never married...

6.7% of those over 65 have been divorced...

14.2% of Boomers have been divorced...

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#9830 - 12/15/05 06:04 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Daisygirl Offline
Member

Registered: 08/25/05
Posts: 1052
Loc: Ohio
No kidding Chatty! I would've thought the divorce numbers would be much higher. That is hopeful, isn't it?

Daisygirl

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#9831 - 12/15/05 07:17 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
foundhervoice, you are very wise to let your kids go. I'm sure you feel empty at times because you probably thought you'd have that hubby along for hte ride as the kids got older. Please know your feelings are normal. What you might want to do to begin filling the gaps is make a list of things you've always wanted to do, books you've wanted to read, movies you've wanted to watch, people you've wanted to spend more time with, etc, then start doing at least one of those things for yourself every week. Just a thought...

You are very wise. I trust you will continue to make good decisions. Please know we are always here for you.

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#9832 - 12/15/05 07:18 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Dianne Offline
Queen of Shoes

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 6123
Loc: Arizona
I almost bit my tongue off trying to keep quiet but when the timing was right, I told him all of these things I discovered about him. He grew very quiet and suddenly wanted to be friends.

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#9833 - 12/16/05 08:51 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
yepthatsme2 Offline
Member

Registered: 08/08/05
Posts: 816
Loc: Fredericksburg, Va.
You are a wise women to keep quiet until all is said and done.

I have never been able to stay quiet when people are lying to my face and I know it.
It's either my mouth or my facial expressions that give me away every time.

Things, I need to work on.

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#9834 - 12/15/05 11:04 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Yepthatsme2, I understand, I too have difficulty staying quite when someone is lying to my face, and unfortunately when I become to over emotional I then look like I'm in the wrong when I'm right!

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#9835 - 12/16/05 03:25 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
starting over Offline
Member

Registered: 06/30/05
Posts: 383
Loc: Illinois
Hi all, it's me with an update of my own. My soon-to-be-ex is on teh 'offensive'. Sending me notes on e-mail, text messaging me and today sent me a 4 page letter about how he doesn't want divorce and prays for us daily, etc. Blah, blah, blah. Since this is the 3rd breakup with him I can now see the pattern. He says whatever he thinks I need to hear and then once I fall for it and come back--it ends and he goes right back to being a bugger.

Unfortunately, even though I can now see the pattern and resist it, it is still emotionally draining and very upsetting. We have been seperated for over a year and he is just now sending/saying these things. why? Because he is about out of time. He has delayed us in court 4 times and he won't be granted anymore extensions. At least now I can see that is doesn't really have anything to do with not wanting a divorce--if that were the case then He would have been saying those things all along. WAiting till the end only proves that it's just to get me to stop.

I know it, but it still hurts. Anyway, thanks for listening! Merry Christmas all!

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#9836 - 12/16/05 03:34 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Bluebird Offline
Member

Registered: 09/20/05
Posts: 2560
Loc: Pagosa Springs, Colorado
Sounds like you know him pretty well and are able to stand your ground. It's very upsetting and it may get worse before it gets better, but we'll all be praying for you. You can get through this!
Peace, starting over.

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#9837 - 12/16/05 04:21 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Dianne Offline
Queen of Shoes

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 6123
Loc: Arizona
I'm so glad you recognized the pattern. That's a good sign...no, a great sign.

You should be very proud of yourself. Merry Christmas to you too and a truly great New Year!

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#9838 - 12/17/05 06:49 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
chatty lady Offline
Writer

Registered: 02/24/04
Posts: 20267
Loc: Nevada
Thank God, starting-over that you finally see through this childish, self serving deception of his. Why not put him on your "no messages" email. That way you won't be bothered with his stupid messages, the slug....

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#9839 - 12/19/05 08:59 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
foundhervoice-atlast Offline
Member

Registered: 07/08/05
Posts: 80
Loc: Colorado
I agree with what all you smart gals said to Starting-Over. Even when you are able to recognize the destructive patterns in a relationship it does not suddenly become an easy thing to deal with. If only it were! But you sound like you have your head screwed on straight now and I am proud of you.

I got a little zinger of my own today...went to pick up my son from a sleepover at the house of a "friend" who I had not heard from for almost 6 months...we had time for a little chat, and I found out that she and her husband had been separated until a couple of weeks ago. She also told me that she had gone out with my husband. She said it was to ask his advice about her own marital situation. Yeah, right. Apparently the ex is not the only person who thinks I am stupid...she knew exactly why we were getting divorced, so asking him for advice is kind of like talking to a flaming sadist about his opinion on being kind to small children and animals.

It hit me like a ton of bricks, and somehow I was able to finish the visit and leave with my pride outwardly intact, but within about 10 minutes on the road it got the better of me and I broke down and cried in front of my children.

I raise my initial question once again: What ever happened to personal integrity?

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#9840 - 12/19/05 05:51 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
jawjaw Offline
Da Queen

Registered: 07/02/03
Posts: 12025
Loc: Alabama
That is simply horrible. Just horrible! And I cannot believe she was so self-serving as to tell you. My guess is she did so to relieve her own self of guilt, OR, the thought he might tell you and she wanted to first. She told you to rid herself of guilt, and to have you say, "oh well, you were only trying to get good advice."

I say, this woman does not deserve your friendship, or consideration. She wanted to dump her own guilt and did so at your expense. Friends don't do that. Course, friends don't date your husbands either. She's a toad.

You are NOT a reflection of her OR him.

You are a real person. With strength, INTEGRITY, and warmth. Carry on honey... don't let her or anyone else stop you. Roar!

JJ

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#9841 - 12/19/05 05:59 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
foundhervoice, how mean can one be? Do you think she had your son over just so she could deliver that bullet?

I'm proud of you for keeping it together in front of her. What are you doing with your anger?

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#9842 - 12/20/05 08:38 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
starting over Offline
Member

Registered: 06/30/05
Posts: 383
Loc: Illinois
foundhervoice, just look at this revelation as an attack, meant to get you off balance. Keep your head up and stand your ground, you'll get through this too.

Chatty--how do I put his e-mails in No message? Does that mean if he sends I don't receive them at all? I would LOVE to do that--it would mean I wouldn't have to change my e-mail address.

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#9843 - 12/20/05 05:43 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
meredithbead Offline
The Divine Ms M

Registered: 07/07/03
Posts: 4894
Loc: Orange County, California
there are various screening programs, depending on your email server. Sometimes it's under mail preferences/options. I have yahoo, and I can specify senders, key words et al that go directly into Trash.

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#9844 - 12/20/05 12:02 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
foundhervoice-atlast Offline
Member

Registered: 07/08/05
Posts: 80
Loc: Colorado
Dotsie,

I don't think she invited my son over in order to deliver this zinger because she paled visibly when she answered the door and saw me standing there. Guess she assumed the ex would be picking up my son, and not me. Bummer for her.

When my older son came home Saturday after a school event and heard that his brother was sleeping over at this kid's house he freaked out and told me that he didn't want to hurt my feelings but he thought I should know that something might be going on between his father and the boy's mother...apparently his dad had admitted being on his way out to lunch with her a few times when my son put him on the spot and asked him where he was going all gussied up on the weekend. I thought the boy was being overly suspicious and pooh-poohed it at the time because the ex had always told me he thought the woman was weird so I couldn't imagine that he'd be attracted to her. Besides, even if he was interested, I never dreamed that she would stoop so low as to betray me. We were supposed to be friends, and where I come from, friends don't go out with friend's husbands. Silly me.

My boys also told me yesterday that they found out that they were all going to meet up at a local ski resort this week (the kids are on Christmas break and their dad is taking them snowboarding) and were supposed to hook up for dinner tonight in fact. My boys didn't know if her husband was planning on being there too, but they were really upset about the whole thing. Guess I'll find out more when they return. I can't believe that their father would put them through this. How callous can one man be? Maybe I should refer to him as the "sperm donor" from now on, cause I can't believe that a real father could behave so selfishly toward his own children and totally ignore their feelings.

In the meantime, yours truly is living on $8 an hour from my part time seasonal retail job at the mall and meager handouts from the soon-to-be-ex, as we still do not have even temporary support orders, and I cannot afford to go out to McDonald's for Christmas let alone take my children skiing for the week. Things have got to get better...Please pray for me! Thanks... [Frown]

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#9845 - 12/20/05 04:38 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
jawjaw Offline
Da Queen

Registered: 07/02/03
Posts: 12025
Loc: Alabama
Foundhervoice,

You have my prayers. And think about this. You may be struggling, but you are the winner and Mr. Sperm Donor is the loser because he is losing, or has lost, the respect of his children. He can't change what they see. Sad.

JJ

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#9846 - 12/20/05 05:43 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
foundhervoice, my heart aches for you. What is he thinking? And she's still married?

jawjaw makes a good point. When all of htis settles down your children will know who did the right thing. Be proud that your integrity is still in the right place. There is a lot to be said for that!

And I will pray for you. Anything else we can do?

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#9847 - 12/20/05 06:37 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Daisygirl Offline
Member

Registered: 08/25/05
Posts: 1052
Loc: Ohio
Foundhervoice, ditto on the above. Your soon to be ex will have to live the rest of his life, knowing what he did. Right now life may seem exciting to him, having a little fling here and there, but at some point he will have to face up to reality. If he doesn't, one day he will stand before God and have some splainin to do.

I pray for you and your boys to have the strength to get through this tough time.

Daisygirl

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#9848 - 12/21/05 08:05 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
starting over Offline
Member

Registered: 06/30/05
Posts: 383
Loc: Illinois
foundhervoice, I don't want to put any pressure on you but since you can see where this is heading, I strongly suggest you find a job that pays better ASAP. The hands-out from husband may disappear as he get s deeper involved with your friend. It might take months to get into court and by then you could be in serious financial trouble.

Take from me I am living the nightmare right now. He left over a year ago and I haven't received even one dime to help with all our bills. I know where he is working adn can pretty much guess how much he makes, but He has managed to delay court 4 times and now I am delayed until Feb.

Meantime, the mortgage company is plannign to foreclose on the house, and I am in debt up to my eyeballs trying to stay afloat....

Since you've got a glimpse of the 'real man' heed the signs and keep moving forward. Just my 'two cents' of advice..take it for what it's worth! Merry Christmas and may God Bless you with a double portion in 2006!

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#9849 - 12/21/05 05:59 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
foundhervoice-atlast Offline
Member

Registered: 07/08/05
Posts: 80
Loc: Colorado
Thank you all for your words of encouragement and advice.

As soon as my seasonal job at the mall is over in January I'll be hunkering down to find more lucrative work. Problem is legal counsel is advising me not to go for it now, because that will reduce the amount of support I can ask for me and the kids. And we all know that whatever I ask for, I'll be lucky to get even half. It seems like the situation is damned if you do, and damned if you don't. I took this job against the lawyer's say-so because I was so freaked out about finances and was afraid there would not be food on the table for the kids to eat. In any case it's a moot point now, since my husband has not been able to find work. Yeah. Right. what a crock.

Starting over - I wish there was something I could do to help you. It breaks my heart to hear what you are going through, and scares me more than a little. The "sperm donor" who was my husband hired a high-priced attorney who is milking him dry and using delay tactics that sound just like what you have experienced. I guess he is trying to wear me down and force me to settle for nothing. Which is what he's proposing to give me anyway, except that there will be legal fees to pay whether I win or lose.

My best thoughts and prayers are with you...We've gotta stay strong and stick together...


foundhervoice_atlast

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#9850 - 12/22/05 08:23 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
starting over Offline
Member

Registered: 06/30/05
Posts: 383
Loc: Illinois
Thanks foundhervoice. You're right we do have to stick together. Unless you are living or have lived through the nightmare of divorce you have no clue just how much emotional trauma each day brings. I understand what your lawyer is saying about work, but perhaps you could do some freelance work or work where you are paid as an independent contractor (in other words no taxes are taken out--you have to pay in April)

Also I would move your banking to a new bank. Just found out my husband has supeonea'd my bank records.....If I had known that I would have moved to a new bank.

Also last minute update. Now he is on a campaign to 'win me back'. Since last Friday I have been bombarded with text messages, phone calls, e-mail. Yesterday a huge poinsetts was delivered, last night when I got home from work there was a box from UPS, inside was several presents for me and my son. 6 mos. ago it was just sign this paper and we can end this divorce right away (I would have been crazy to sign--he got 1/2 and I got all debts!) He said it was taking too long and he watned to get on with his life. Now it's oh, honey, I love you I miss you....Yeah right.

He's either worried that he might not come out of divorce in good shape OR he is trying to get me off balance while he manuevers behind my back (like getting bank records) OR he's hoping I'll feel guilty and be 'nice' in court.

Why are men such slimeballs? I'll say it again, better to be single and happy and not be at risk than live in such craziness.

Anyway, Merry Christmas all. Foundhervoice, no matter how bad it gets, just remember, this too you will survive. It will get worse before it gets better, but oh, the joy that comes in the morning! And once survived, you will emerge stronger, more confidant, with more self-esteem and the ability to minister to others in a similar situation. You will be blessed!

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#9851 - 12/21/05 09:22 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
jawjaw Offline
Da Queen

Registered: 07/02/03
Posts: 12025
Loc: Alabama
Very wise words StartingOver. Indeed. Everyone said, "he will do this...or he will do that." I thought, what do they know? They don't know him. I lived with him all these years and know his good points, they just don't see them. They are full of crap...well guess what? He suckered me in with his pity trip and I was left holding the bag, with egg on my face...while he got it all, or most of it, AND married our next door neighbor as soon as the waiting period was over. HE WILL DO IT. Don't think just because he has a good side (if he does) that he won't. PEOPLE CHANGE COMPLETELY WHEN IT COMES TO MONEY. Read that over and over and over. Commit it to memory. Just because YOU have compassion, doesn't mean HE does. Repeat that line until it becomes your mantra! Remember the old "Warning Will Rogers! Warning!" from that space show in the 50's? Well, consider this yours honey...cause he CAN and he WILL!

JJ

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#9852 - 12/21/05 10:56 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Founderhvoiceat last:

As a paralegal, I agree w/ your attorney, your increased income can and may decrease the support (please review your financial declaration/child support calculation; if you like you may prepare a comparison between the present w/ season employment vs. what you may expect to earn for both -- your state may have the child support calculator on-line). Once you have an Order of the Court (not certain of the family court rules of procedure in your state) determining the support, and once you feel comfortable with that Final Decree (or Order) -- then look for employment. Now, caution, he may file a motion afterwards stating that your income has increased, thus lessening the amount of support he must provide (I just want you to be aware), however, this will cost him money and more time in Court.

Starting Over:

Regarding the Christmas presents, I would allow the children to have thier's on Christmas (or appropriate holiday gathering), but do not open yours. Simply return them or set aside as evidence.

Regarding the subpoena for bank account statements, it is a part of the discovery process. Unfortunately, it seems like an invasion of privacy.

Although I'm not certain of your financial life, when I was in the process of divorcing I opened a new account at a bank that neither I nor my husband had ever had conducted business and explained the situation to the individual assisting with opening the new account. I also requested that the statements be sent to my office, rather than home address. I opened a non-interest account so that it would not reflect on my taxes in the event he (husband) tried to obtain a copy during the divorce proceedings.

I took all money from my old accounts in cash not to exceed $5K (to keep under the IRS and FBI eyes) and deposited into the new account. Luckily, I only needed this account for about 6 mths until the divorce was finalized.

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#9853 - 12/22/05 12:28 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
starting over Offline
Member

Registered: 06/30/05
Posts: 383
Loc: Illinois
MustangGal, sounds like I should have had a talk with you a long time ago. Not that I had that kind of $$ to worry about.

OK, so he can subpeana my records, but I'm not allowed to know where he is working or how much he makes or subpeana his records?? I don't understand why that's right. I meet with attorney tonight--we have a LOT to discuss.

jawJaw, Amen sister--you tell her! Foundhervoice--it may sound like we are ranting bitter women--NOT SO! Just older and wiser. We have been down the road and know what lies ahead.

I read the other day that when it comes to divorce, women want to be fair and men want to win. They have a deep seeded need to win. They can't look like the looser in the end, somehow they have to save face--so be a wise woman and stick to your game plan, don't give in, don't take anything laying down and be mentally, physically and spiritually prepared for what lies ahead. We're here to cheer you on!

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#9854 - 12/22/05 02:54 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
chatty lady Offline
Writer

Registered: 02/24/04
Posts: 20267
Loc: Nevada
Both of you NO any of you in this situation waiting on the finalization of your divorce from these "slugs." Don't just change the bank account location because they have easy ways of finding them, CANCEL it completely and use cash or money orders to pay bills etc. Tell no one not even your own attorney what you are doing, just say there is no money, I'm destitute....I had a shark of an Attorney for my divorce and he taught me every dirty trick that these "slugs" try and we beat my ex to it every time. My lawyer was very expensive but I didn't care the ex's have to pay court costs and attornys fee because I was destitute, remember, yea sure I was, LOL! I offer you any advice for free that you might ask. My Lawyer was already paid and I can use the information as much as I want to...If you can prove (private detective) that this married b-witch is cavorting with your husband, he still is legally! You can SUE her for allianation of affections. Boy wouldn't that get her married smart assed panties in a sling...last laugh there! Just be cautious and do it to him before he does it to you...that goes for all the soon to be ex's...and for Gods sake don't believe a thing they say, they will try anything if they think they are not going to win out.

[ December 21, 2005, 06:59 PM: Message edited by: chatty lady ]

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#9855 - 12/22/05 03:00 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
Daisygirl Offline
Member

Registered: 08/25/05
Posts: 1052
Loc: Ohio
Chatty, you can do that? I had proof my husband was cheating and my attorney said the court doesn't care! Of course, that's Ohio for you.

Daisygirl

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#9856 - 12/22/05 03:03 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
chatty lady Offline
Writer

Registered: 02/24/04
Posts: 20267
Loc: Nevada
Not true unless things have changed drastically in a couple of years. You have to show proof however and then sue the woman as I said and then you can also prove asdultrey on his part. If you're already divorced I think it too late.

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#9857 - 12/22/05 12:18 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
foundhervoice-atlast Offline
Member

Registered: 07/08/05
Posts: 80
Loc: Colorado
Chatty Lady -

I have to concur with Daisygirl. I live in a no-fault state and according to my lawyer, even if i can prove that the spermdonor was fooling around while we were married it will not affect the spousal support settlement. It could, however, have an impact on the parental control issues, by way of showing what an immoral jerk the kids' dad is. But then that would require an additional civil lawsuit or atleast make things drag out considerably and that costs money I do not have. That does not mean I won't do it: it just means that I have to consider all sides of the issue carefully before i put my kids through any more trauma.

The other thing I am hearing is that since my kids are older, it may not be worth the headache. My oldest will be going into his senior year of h.s. next fall and be independent potentially before this lawsuit can even get settled. The younger one is pretty savvy about what's going on, and can assert himself in court if it should come down to to it, so I may not require any additional litigation.

I would soooo appreciate any additional advice you could give me about this whole nasty business. Who better to learn from than someone who has already been there? Sorry you had to go through it. I hope that your life has since improved.

Many thanx.

Foundhervoice-atlast [Smile]

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#9858 - 12/22/05 12:46 PM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
foundhervoice-atlast Offline
Member

Registered: 07/08/05
Posts: 80
Loc: Colorado
Wow! Truer words have never been spoken, JJ!

I felt exactly like you did at first. For 20+ years the spermdonor (he-who-shall-no-longer-be-properly-named)kept telling me what a good guy he was. A friend of mine who was a therapist prior to children and subsequent divorce cued me that a person who is genuinely good does not need to advertise it. Good point. I'll admit that for years his claim confused me. I kept thinking, if he is such a good guy, what is wrong with me for not seeing it? Hmmm. We all know the answer to that one!

Well the gig is up. whenever he wants something from me or is planning something nasty behind my back that he wants to zing me with in court he changes his tone of voice and drips sugar. He fluctuates back and forth between that and giving me the cold shoulder. How obvious is that? Maybe he's been bi-polar all these years and I didn't know it? Nah.

The other thing my girlfriend told me is something that i want to share with all of you who may be going through this heartache, especially if you have children. She told me to consider that the reason a son (or daughter, I guess?)is better off having a relationship with his father even if he is a no-good-lying-you-know-what is because the father will probably revert back to the uninvolved parent he was before the divorce eventually because it is impossible to keep up the pretense forever, and the child will figure things out for himself if given half a chance. Material bribes will only take your child so far (I hope!)But in order for that to happen, you cannot interfere. Even if this means your child's feelings will get hurt. I spent upwards of 15 years trying to cover up the ex's uninvolvement with his children, and make up for everything he should have been feeling for them or doing with them. As a wise woman recently told me, how the heck will my kids ever figure out who their dad is if I am constantly covering up for him?

As far as what kind of influence will a bad dad have on his children she reminded me that if nothing else, my kids will have a glaring up-front-and-in-their-face-example of what kind of father they do not want to grow up to be. I found that strangely reassuring. If that makes me a bad person, then mea culpa. It could be worse. At least I'm not bad-mouthing him to them.

foundhervoice-atlast

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#9859 - 12/23/05 03:13 AM Re: Whatever happened to integrity?
chatty lady Offline
Writer

Registered: 02/24/04
Posts: 20267
Loc: Nevada
Oh how right you are foundherownvoice at last, NEVER bad mouth these slugs to the children because its absolutely true that they will eventually do the harm themselves, as your friend said keeping up the cherade becomes too hard as time goes by especially if they (slugs) can't irritate you in some way by being the good dad!!! There is a perfect saying:

Give A Person Enough Rope and Eventually They'll Hang Themselves.

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