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#51813 - 07/05/03 03:48 PM being left out
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
I have seen this happen and wanted to know if it has happened to anyone in here... and if so...what can you do about it? I would love to give my friend some words of encouragement, but haven't experienced this first-hand.

Sometimes women leave their husband's family out. Because women tend to be the social planners when it comes to family plans, they make most things revolve around their family.

The poor grandmother and grandfather(parents of husband)get left out. I don't understand why the husband doesn't point it out, or do something to make a difference, but it hurts the paternal grandparents...and the baby/children also lose out by not having more close relationships.

This somehow goes back to the mother-in-law relationships too, I think.

Any ideas on this one? [Wink]

[ July 05, 2003, 08:49 AM: Message edited by: Dotsie ]

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#51814 - 07/05/03 03:52 PM Re: being left out
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
Actually, it doesn't even have to be with grandchildren. It can also be about spending time with parents once you are married.

I am thinking the answer goes back to something that comes up at prayer group so often.

Expectations...possibly we need to lower them and be pleasantly surprised when people want to spend time with us...but that seems to simple. [Razz]

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#51815 - 07/05/03 06:21 PM Re: being left out
Maggie Offline
Member

Registered: 02/19/03
Posts: 765
Loc: Oregon
Yes, this happened to us only we spent more time with his family especially after my father died and my mother went into the nursing home. However things happen and we don't want to do this as much. My husband tells me he would rather be with my family.
This Christmas they are all coming here and were all looking forward to it.
In his family his brother is to the point where he hardly speaks and when we go to my family functions they let us know we weren't there because brothers are supposed to be closer than cousins.
In my family everyone talks all the time even catching up when we've emailed or written letters.
The family dynamics are interesting and I've tried. In fact I told my sister n' laws friend that if it hadn't been for me my husband wouldn't go visit his mother as much. I am whining here not bragging because I think its so sad that she pushes them away. I feel really blessed and grateful to have grown up in my extended families.

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#51816 - 07/12/03 05:41 PM Re: being left out
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
Maggie you said, "if it hadn't been for me my husband wouldn't go visit his mother as much".

I have found this to be true in my marriage too. [Razz] I think it is because men in general don't communicate as much as women do. [Razz] We find ourselves keeping up with the friends and family because that's what we tend to do.

I often say to my husband, "Have you talked to your mom or dad lately?"...or, "I think we need to check in with your mom and dad."

Yet, sometimes I think the mothers of our husbands think we keep them from their sons. We can't help it if the guys aren't the big communicators that we women are.

Make sense? [Confused]

Maybe that is one of the reasons their is this whole mother-in-law/daughter-in-law thing that has been mentioned in here before.

All I know is that I have 2 sons and 1 daughter so I have all this to look forward to. [Big Grin]

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#51817 - 07/14/03 07:35 AM Re: being left out
Maggie Offline
Member

Registered: 02/19/03
Posts: 765
Loc: Oregon
yes, I do agree with you and I even remember my mother asking my father how long it had been since he called his mother.
We have one son so will probably face it too.
I also think we women are the nurtures(sp) and that could add in here too. I have also seen this work the other way when the daughter in law doesn't get along with her family and the inlaws become close. Its happening with my extended family. Because the family member saw what was happening with my mother in law and me she and I have been able to be really open with each other.
This is one of my cousins daughter in laws.
People dynamics always fascinate me.
Maggie

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#51818 - 03/23/05 02:15 AM Re: being left out
mammajude Offline
Member

Registered: 01/04/05
Posts: 102
Loc: San Diego, Ca
Boy, I'm glad you brought this up. I was just about to post something about this. My son got married and has a little boy who is 17 mos old. tomorrow. Seems like his wife wants everything to do with her family but not with us. The only time we get to see them is if we go to Az. from Ca. I used to get photos and little videos of my grandson but no more. She won't even email me back when I email her. Weird. I'm sorry but my Mom and I call this being "Pussy Whipped" Parden the phrase..
but its so true. I see it happening a lot to families. NOT GOOD>
I need to talk to my son one of these days about it. If I can ever get him alone. I've tried so hard to be a good mother in law. I don't bug them. I only call them once every two weeks or so. From what I understand her Mom calls her everyday. What's up with that? She's in another state but so is my Mom and I don't talk to her everyday. Anyway... I'm tired of the whole nonsense....

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#51819 - 03/23/05 06:28 AM Re: being left out
chatty lady Offline
Writer

Registered: 02/24/04
Posts: 20267
Loc: Nevada
Mammajude it sounds like things are pretty messed up. Why not go for a visit and instead of talking to your P.W. son alone, talk to them together, honestly and right in her face. Get the answers you deserve. Make the @#$%$ say whats on her mind. Things couldn't get much worse than they are now and she will continue to cut you out if she sees she can, so you may as well bring it out in the open now. It'll either mend the fence or knock it down.....

[ March 23, 2005, 11:19 AM: Message edited by: Dotsie ]

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#51820 - 03/23/05 07:22 PM Re: being left out
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
mamma, keep reaching out. I think it's a good idea to talk with your son. Write them notes. Send them cards. Don't give up. This is your son and you want a relationship with him. Go for it.

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#51821 - 03/24/05 06:32 PM Re: being left out
lionspaaw Offline
Member

Registered: 11/28/02
Posts: 887
Loc: SW Florida
I guess now I can comment on this since I have an official daughter-in-law now [Smile]

My daughter-in-law talks to her mother daily I'm sure - eventhough they live states away from each other - but if I want to know what's going on with my son - I have to call - eventhough I live in the same town -- and even then I don't speak to him usually -- but to my D-I-L -- as he really hates "chit-chatting" on the phone.

Daughters just naturally stay closer to their moms than sons do. A daughter may grow into a woman but she'll always be her mommy's little girl. A son, on the other hand, grows into a man. Period. No more mommy's little boy.

besides -- son's don't need their mommy's as much once they marry -- they have their WIVES to take our places [Wink]

Women do communicate more than men. We want to share all our thoughts with other women -- case in point -- THIS FORUM. We don't see this type of forum for MEN anywhere do we ????

But I also think we mothers have to take some of the responsibility for the situation. Not that I'm the perfect person here -- but I try not to be my son's mother around his wife. He belongs to HER now -- just like I try not to be a pushy grandma -- I raised my child and now they have to raise theirs -- and I feel it's no longer my place to tell them how to either live their marriage or to raise their child. Ohhhhh - I have to bite my tongue alot [Smile] but I think that's one reason I get along so well with my D-I-L -- I'm no threat to her as a wife or as a mother. She knows I love her and I am here for them if they need me and I have just accepted the fact that I will never be as much a part of their life as her family will be.

I agree with Dotsie that you need to discuss this with your son and his wife. Lay your feelings out on the table -- and ask them to please respect those feelings as much as they can -- just as you promise to respect their feelings on the matter as best you can. Go into the discussion as one person to another -- a business agreement as such -- because if you go into it with a hurtful, resentful attitude -- it will come across as "all you" -- she'll get defensive -- he'll be put in the position of having to take sides -- and the point will be completely lost.

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#51822 - 03/24/05 09:05 PM Re: being left out
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
lion, I am so glad to have you posting again. Your point is beautifully posted...and very wise.

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#51823 - 03/25/05 04:35 AM Re: being left out
mammajude Offline
Member

Registered: 01/04/05
Posts: 102
Loc: San Diego, Ca
Thanks for the input your all right.. The funny thing is I live in Ca. They live in Az. We hardly get to talk. I do call my son to talk to him. His wife acts this way with our whole family though. Sometimes she won't even acknowledge that your there or say hi when you walk in the door..etc. Its really weird... I think she gets jealous of Davids' relationships with his family. Sad to say. I don't say much. I stay out of there way.. I do send cards and make things for my grandson and for them.
Have a Great Easter everyone..

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#51824 - 03/26/05 08:21 AM Re: being left out
lionspaaw Offline
Member

Registered: 11/28/02
Posts: 887
Loc: SW Florida
Sending cards to your grandson and keeping in touch the best you can is about all you can do sometimes. Hopefully your D-I-L will grow up one day and realize what she's been missing - the opportunity to have had 2 mom's [Smile]

My son is probably going to be moving far far away from me shortly -- and logically I know that they have to live their own life and the opportunity for them is better where they're going then here -- motherly I'm going to miss them soooooo much -- so in a few months I may be crying on your shoulder for support [Smile] I think the worst part will not being "grandma" on a daily basis anymore [Frown]

I guess now we can all understand how our parents felt when we left home [Smile]

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#51825 - 03/26/05 08:47 AM Re: being left out
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
Lion, you said:

I guess now we can all understand how our parents felt when we left home.

You aren't kidding. I don't know how my mom did it. I admire her more each day. She was so good at minding her own business. My older sister and I talk about this now, though we didn't realize it at the time. I hope I can mind my own business and let my kids do as they please. She really let us use our wings to fly and I know it wasn't easy because we weren't always making perfect choices.

Mamma, keep reaching out. I think you may have hit the nail on the head when you mentioned jealousy. Hopefully she'll outgrow that.

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#51826 - 03/26/05 05:01 AM Re: being left out
chatty lady Offline
Writer

Registered: 02/24/04
Posts: 20267
Loc: Nevada
I know now but never realized before and I find myself wondering why we all moved away so far?

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#51827 - 03/26/05 06:35 AM Re: being left out
lionspaaw Offline
Member

Registered: 11/28/02
Posts: 887
Loc: SW Florida
I guess, like most things, we don't realize how things "hurt" until it happens to us personally.

My sister and her family live in the mid-west and my brother lives out in Montana. I stay here in Florida for one reason - my parents. They are in their 80's and I just can't leave them alone - so when the kids leave - eventhough we want to move closer to them -- my parents need us more than they do so here we'll stay ---

It just seems a shame that we have to make choices like that -- I would fit right in with those huge families that all live on the same block [Smile]

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#51828 - 03/26/05 07:11 PM Re: being left out
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
Boy how times have changed. While traveling last weekend we kept commenting on the number of people who fly these days. Remember when everyone lived in the same town and the most you had to do was drive a mile to see them? I'm wiht you lion.

I think the hard part is when a parent is sick in another town. Trying to juggle life to get to that parent must be so stressful. I remember what my out of town sister went through when mom was sick and dying. Fortunately, she brought most of her work with her on her lap top, but her family still had to do without her for weeks.

Bring back the good old days.

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#51829 - 03/27/05 08:40 AM Re: being left out
copygal Offline
Member

Registered: 03/05/05
Posts: 134
Loc: Texas
MammaJude,
I know just how you feel. We had much the same scenario going with my DIL. We always thought she just didn't care for us because we were so different from her family. They call her every day, tell her and my son what to do, how to do it, then get mad at them when they don't. My husband and I decided early on to stick with a non-interference policy. We'd be there if our kids needed us, otherwise, we'd keep our noses out of their business. Unfortunately, that got us pretty much ignored. Her parents took it too far however and our DIL rebelled when they began yelling at her in front of our little grandson and undermining her authority. She called them on it and insisted they change their ways. It's not going very well for her, sadly. In the meantime, she and I have grown closer; we talk more, spend more time together. One day, she said, "Why can't my mother be more like you?" I know my mouth dropped open, I was mind-boggled. Frankly, I feel sorry for her parents, at all they are missing, because they'd rather be right in their own minds than have a good relationship with their daughter. Plus, they are missing out on time with their grandsons. Foolish people.

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#51830 - 03/28/05 01:10 AM Re: being left out
chatty lady Offline
Writer

Registered: 02/24/04
Posts: 20267
Loc: Nevada
I am so fortunate to have a wonderful loving daughter-in-law. She is like a best friend and comes to me for advice on cooking homemaking etc. I love her to death and feel more like she is my own daughter. If she has her way we would all live in a big home together, she feels like I do and who knows maybe one day we will. Its sad we don't learn how important family is when we're very young.... [Frown]

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#51831 - 03/29/05 08:16 AM Re: being left out
Dianne Offline
Queen of Shoes

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 6123
Loc: Arizona
I'm close to my DIL and SIL. I refuse to interfere and if my daughter is having a problem, I send her a book on the topic rather than give my advice. She has children to consider and I'd hate to see them without their Daddy, a very loving father.

I never talk to my DIL about problems unless she brings them up. She's a wonderful mother to my grandkids and has tolerated a lot from my son. She knows I'll always be there for her.

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#51832 - 03/28/05 09:58 PM Re: being left out
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
Dianne, I love the idea of sending books instead of giving your advice. Does she mind getting the books? DO you mention them ahead of time?

Chatty, I have two sons. I'm already praying they'll marry loving gals.

Copy, you are wise. It sounds like you've given up control. I think some parents try too hard to make a difference once the kids leave home.

My parents set a good example in this depratment. Mom is sadly gone. Dad continues to mind his business, but somehow gently gives an idea of his feelings concerning sticky situations. I hope he's around longer becasue I still need to learn how he does it!

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#51833 - 10/05/05 07:58 AM Re: being left out
Scorpio115 Offline
Member

Registered: 10/03/05
Posts: 44
Loc: New York
We're long-distance grandparents. I never thought I could love grandchildren as much as I do but my husband and I never get to see them. Just 4 days this year alone, for the miles do make all the difference. I'm always depressed,jealous of my friends who babysit, go to birthday parties, recitals, etc. I cry every day because of these lost opportunities.

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#51834 - 10/05/05 08:47 AM Re: being left out
chickadee Offline
Member

Registered: 09/26/04
Posts: 3910
Loc: Alabama
Scorpio, I share your long distance family relationship. I bought my kids a webcam and I am *there* when the grandkids have birthdays or we just wave back and forth.

My granddaughter(age 13) and I chat on MSN or the phone. My grandson (age 4+)and I chat on the phone, yes I call every day, to Canada.

I send a package once a month to grandson and my grandaughter and I shop online(age difference, she knows what she likes). She orders(I limit) and I pay.

I have a brand new grandson and I have a package all ready to go tomorrow. If they see me and hear me and get surprises from me, they won't forget me.

Yes being a grandma long distance is terrible, just terrible but I have found ways to overcome and make the distance shorter. I hope this helps you too.

The packages are just little things I pick up here and there and the phone bill is a package deal...the webcam only cost 19.99 at Walmart.

I visit only once a year and haven't seen my new grandbaby yet....soon I hope.

Two are in Newfoundland and one in Ontario now so I have to plan to do the round trip thing.

Your post touched me and I thought I'd share the little ways I have overcome my yearning for them...they are precious and yes it's amazing how much we can love them, I agree totally.

We can't babysit, attend functions etc...but we can be there in other ways. Hope this helps.

My grandson got a package just 2 days ago...today he asked the postmistress...any packages for me today? Ha ha, see he anticipates getting them from Nanny(that's me. [Cool] )

Now I'm homesick [Wink]
Hugs
chick

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#51835 - 10/05/05 05:38 PM Re: being left out
Dianne Offline
Queen of Shoes

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 6123
Loc: Arizona
For those of you who have family in another country, I'd like to recommend Skype. You have to buy a special headset by Logitech, which isn't expensive. My sister in France also has it and we can talk for free anytime. Not sure if you can talk free in the states but if you go to their site, I'm sure they will give that info.

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#51836 - 10/06/05 07:03 AM Re: being left out
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
Chick, will you adopt me as your grandchild?

Do you send them virtual cakes?

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#51837 - 10/06/05 07:49 AM Re: being left out
Scorpio115 Offline
Member

Registered: 10/03/05
Posts: 44
Loc: New York
Chickadee:
I appreciate your situation but you've found a way to make it work for you. I've spent a fortune on sending down gifts, clothes, etc. I have a houseful of photos as well. Communication drops off because of busy schedules and to tell you the truth, there is no physical presence. I'd rather hand a toy to my grandchild than have a postman do so. I want to hug them not wave. I'm sure you feel the same way. I've been trying for years to make this work but they don't meet me half way. When was the last time yours visited you? I know that this message may sound angry. It isn't directed at you personally. It is at my son who hasn't come up with his family in over 3 years. He still has relatives up here. And, I'd like my grandchildren to have memories of Grandma and Grandpa's house as well. You see, it can only work two-ways.

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#51838 - 10/05/05 11:18 PM Re: being left out
chickadee Offline
Member

Registered: 09/26/04
Posts: 3910
Loc: Alabama
Dianne, I will look into Skype...sounds good. Thanks.

Dotsie,I would adopt you any day. We'd have to do the long distance relationship thingy still.

Scorpio, I completely understand how you miss the personal side of hugging your grandchildren or handing them a toy. I truly hope your son sees how important it is for his children to know, love and occassionaly visit their grand parents.Have you expressed your feelings to him about this?(I am guessing maybe you have.)and how did he react? What reason is he giving. What about the DIL's parents? Are they close or far away like you? I hope everything works out for you soon. How old are your grandbabies?

Hugs
chick

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#51839 - 10/06/05 02:03 AM Re: being left out
Scorpio115 Offline
Member

Registered: 10/03/05
Posts: 44
Loc: New York
Chick:
Son won't discuss it. Very sensitive topic. I suspect that he feels a bit guilty as he moved to appease his wife. Her parents retired and relocated to that state and her siblings followed. Would've been a bit easier to swallow had there been a more valid reason to put so many miles between us. So they're the only family the kids know. We are just novelties as they see us so seldom. Understandably, it is hard for them to travel. There's always a reason not to, but what about the reasons to visit? Granddaughters are seven and four and the new grandson just turned one. Weren't there for any of the big events. Not one holiday either way. Their solution is for us to move. Leaving others behind. However, very tempting as those are our only grandchildren. No easy answer.

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#51840 - 10/06/05 02:56 AM Re: being left out
Dianne Offline
Queen of Shoes

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 6123
Loc: Arizona
Scorpio, do you get invited to visit them or are you basically ignored? I'd hop on a plane and get me some grandkids lovin' in a flash!

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#51841 - 10/06/05 05:26 AM Re: being left out
Scorpio115 Offline
Member

Registered: 10/03/05
Posts: 44
Loc: New York
Dianne:
Not entirely ignored but not encouraged to visit very much, just to move there. Not easy to hop on planes either, you must know that. If it were, we'd be there more than once a year. See, we didn't move but the onus is ours to make it work. They do nothing to bridge the gap. If they came here once a year, at least for a holiday, and we went down there at least twice, it wouldn't be as natural as it was meant to be but a heck of a lot better. Our situtation is so unique we don't know what to do.

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#51842 - 10/06/05 05:45 PM Re: being left out
Dianne Offline
Queen of Shoes

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 6123
Loc: Arizona
Is there some kind of hidden anger going on? Is your son carrying animosity toward you for some unknown reason? I just don't understand how a spouse can carry so much influence without it. Just asking as my stepson and wife are pregnant and I know I'll rarely see the baby. I'm not even sure what I'll be to the baby. Sad.

I know it's not easy to always hop on a plane and I don't know where you live but I signed up for Southwest Airlines announcements and always watch for special deals on flights to AZ. I've found some really cheap ones. I have six grandkids and they all live in Az so I understand the distance and how your arms ache to hold those children.

I'm really sorry you're going through this pain. It must be awful.

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#51843 - 10/06/05 06:07 PM Re: being left out
Daisygirl Offline
Member

Registered: 08/25/05
Posts: 1052
Loc: Ohio
Scorpio, I would be in your situation if I lived out of town. When I divorced, I moved to the same town as my son so I could be closer to them. Ever since my grandson was a baby, I would call them and ask if he could spend the night with me. Every since, I get him every other weekend for one night and they count on it, too. They live right down the street from DIL's mom and it is very natural for her to have more of a relationship with her, so I made sure I get my time with him.

Daisygirl

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#51844 - 10/07/05 04:07 AM Re: being left out
Scorpio115 Offline
Member

Registered: 10/03/05
Posts: 44
Loc: New York
No, I don't believe he is carrying any grudges. We made sure not to cause any conflict. Let him go with a peaceful mind. No hurt. Figured it was best that way. Truly, if there is any anger it is inside of himself towards himself for allowing this situation to be. We always had a very tight, good and loving family structure and we truly have a good relationship with our DIL. They are just not extending themselves and hiding behind a list of reasons. I know it's difficult but they should've factored all this in when they made the decision to move. We have tried and have schlepped back and forth over the years but there are family members (my Mom) who is too old and fragile to travel and thus never sees her great-grandchildren. I guess it is what it is. I basically started this chat to see if anyone else was dealing with a similar issue and how they coped. I'm at a loss.

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#51845 - 10/07/05 09:55 PM Re: being left out
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
I know a woman who is dealing with a similar situation. Even when the kids come to town they stay with her DIL's family. The part that saddens me is that my friend's son won't satnd up to his wife. When they come home all the plans revolve around the DIL's family. My friend gets the leftovers. And belive me, my friend and her husband have so much love to share.

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#51846 - 10/13/05 03:31 PM Re: being left out
lionspaaw Offline
Member

Registered: 11/28/02
Posts: 887
Loc: SW Florida
Dotsie - you mention that your friend gets the leftovers.

Sometimes that's not such a bad thing. I dont know your friends situation, but maybe if she looked at it from a different angle ???

Sometimes people are with the "ones that come to town" under an "obligation" of some sort. Or maybe they feel they HAVE TO be with them. When the kids come to visit your friend -- could it be because they really WANT to be with them ??

Sometimes - quality really is better than quantity ;-)

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#51847 - 10/13/05 04:50 PM Re: being left out
Dotsie Offline
Founder

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 23647
Loc: Maryland
Aha, I like that spin.

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#51848 - 10/30/05 12:32 AM Re: being left out
Mamacat Offline
Member

Registered: 10/29/05
Posts: 17
Loc: Midwest
My DIL has a personality disorder. Truly. She talks of no one but herself (not even her kids ages 5 and 2). She is ALWAYS sick or hurt and is unable to hold a job because of her illnesses. That is all she talks about. She does not like our family - mostly me. Last time i had the 5-year-old over (for a tea party with my nieces girls) she called and said if I didn't have her back by a certain time, she would call the police and have me put in jail!! My son has no cahunas. They live 5 miles away and we see the children maybe 6-10 times a year. It is absolutely dreadful. They are our only grandchildren and he is our only son. We have 3 adopted girls which my DIL won't consider her husbands sisters. Although they have been here since they were one (now 30, 18 and 13).
We've always had a close, fun family.

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#51849 - 11/03/05 09:43 AM Re: being left out
flipperjo Offline
Member

Registered: 10/22/05
Posts: 254
Loc: ND
What an interesting topic to come across here! This is the very thing I talked to my hubby about when our first grand was born last Feb.

I found a little corner of real sadness in my heart just because I know that a girl who has any kind of decent relationship with her mother will always gravitate there, not to the MIL. I am perhaps a little extra sensitive to this because our only daughter died at age 13, leaving us with 2 beautiful sons. When you lose a child, you also lose her future including the family she may have had.

I could immediately see the difference in the way my DIL brought her child to her mom and my son brought her to me. It is not a fault within anyone, it is simply the way we are made and the way a good mother/daughter relationship works. I am very close to both of my sons but it will never be the same as it would have been with Missi or it is with DIL and her mom.

My DIL and I have a wonderful relationship and she is very conscious of the fact that I miss my own daughter. She really does go out of her way to include me in things. At the same time, she is very close to her own mom and they spend a lot of time together.

I am soooooo VERY blessed to be my granddaughter's main daycare provider. I have nothing to complain about but in my heart, I will never be my grown daughter's mother and that is where my sorrow will forever exist in the background of my life.

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