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#220287 - 07/14/14 03:10 AM Pastor Loses Job for Marrying Son
Anne Holmes Administrator Offline
Boomer in Chief

Registered: 03/12/10
Posts: 3182
Loc: Illinois
This is an interesting story IMHO.

A pastor lost his job -- was defrocked -- because he chose to officiate at the marriage of his gay son.

I think the scenario is very well-explained in this New York Times article.

My question to discuss here is this: Would you support this pastor's actions? What would you have done if you found yourself in a similar situation?

There's a lot to think about here. I liked where Rev. Frank Schaefer says, speaking about his son,
Quote:
“His own church was saying to him that, as a homosexual, you can’t go to heaven,” Frank Schaefer said. “That’s not necessarily what the church would officially say, but that’s what he heard, and it devastated him because faith had always been very important to him. I remember how I said to him: ‘It’s so obvious you did not choose this for yourself. This is who you are, and this is who God created you to be. You are created in the image of God, just like everybody else.’ ”


Wow!

Anne
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#220288 - 07/14/14 04:14 PM Re: Pastor Loses Job for Marrying Son [Re: Anne Holmes]
yonuh Offline
Member

Registered: 06/14/06
Posts: 2447
Loc: Arizona
I think if for-profit corporations can deny their employees certain benefits based on the owners 'conscience', then everybody else has the right to follow their own conscience, too. First of all, I wouldn't belong to a church that was homophobic. Second, if I did, I would support the pastor for following his own beliefs.

Gay people don't choose to be gay any more than we choose to be straight, or white, or blonde, or blue-eyed. And I don't believe homosexuality is addressed in the New Testament at all, but I could be wrong. So anyway, I think those 'Christians' who slam homosexuality and believe the Old Testament punishments for it are being hypocritical. They are picking out certain OT laws and ignoring others. First and foremost is the Golden Rule; everything else is secondary.
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#220289 - 07/14/14 09:33 PM Re: Pastor Loses Job for Marrying Son [Re: yonuh]
Anne Holmes Administrator Offline
Boomer in Chief

Registered: 03/12/10
Posts: 3182
Loc: Illinois
We're totally on the same page, Yonuh!

And what you say corresponds with what the pastor said in the article. I loved where he told his son that since we are all created in God's image, God must love him as much as he would love anyone else.

He sounds like a true man of God, and I was happy to read at the end of the article that he was quickly recruited by another church.

As well as that the son decided to go to seminary. I loved the image of the son as a young child, building an altar out of Legos, and holding a service for his stuffed animals. I've NEVER seen a kid do this, so clearly he was "called" at a young age.
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#220292 - 07/14/14 10:24 PM Re: Pastor Loses Job for Marrying Son [Re: Anne Holmes]
jabber Offline
Member

Registered: 02/17/05
Posts: 9984
Loc: New York State
A person's love for their children goes beyond what the world thinks, as does God's love for us. No matter what my son does
or says, I will always love him.


yonuh, Romans 1:26 & 27 talks about the aforementioned life- style and God's unhappiness with it. But Jesus dying on the Cross to take away the sins of the world for all time, is the core of Christianity. So if same sex relationships are sin, God has already paid the price to make them sinless. The problem is, IMHO, Biblical messages can be mixed-messages sometimes. For example: you can't earn your way into Heaven; but if you obey God's laws and teachings, He rewards good behavior. So, I choose to believe God is a Good God. His thoughts are higher than our thoughts. His ways are higher than our ways. He is Love. And what I take away from scripture is to have mercy, understanding, and love and do what's honest and right. If this sounds corny that's because I'm a country bumpkin.
whistle
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#220293 - 07/17/14 06:29 PM Re: Pastor Loses Job for Marrying Son [Re: jabber]
Anne Holmes Administrator Offline
Boomer in Chief

Registered: 03/12/10
Posts: 3182
Loc: Illinois
Jabber, I wouldn't consider you a country bumpkin, in any way.

But with regard to religion, and what kind of a God we believe we worship, my impressions of this are heavily colored by a three-day weekend I spent roughly 30 years ago, called a Cursillo Encounter. As a result of this, I believe in a loving God, not a vengeful or punitive God.

I won't belabor my support of the Cursillo Movement, but I will say that it is a Christian movement that started in Spain by Roman Catholics (I think in the 1940s) and now involves many mainline Christian churches, including Episcopalian, Lutheran, Methodist and Presbyterian, as well as a huge number of non-denominational movements.

As I recall, it began when a group of men dedicated themselves to bringing the young men of their Spanish community, in order to know Christ better.

Initially they prayed and worked together; it developed as they talked together, sharing their thoughts about the state of the world and the effectiveness of their efforts to bring the light of Christ to it.
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#220294 - 07/17/14 10:18 PM Re: Pastor Loses Job for Marrying Son [Re: Anne Holmes]
jabber Offline
Member

Registered: 02/17/05
Posts: 9984
Loc: New York State
I believe in a loving God, too. Didn't want to imply otherwise.
Don't think I said anything about Him being vengeful. Didn't mean to.
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"MOLLIE'S FOLLIES" by Bonnie Mill-Lemke, aka Jabber, is available at the Kindle Store and in paperback on Amazon.com.

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#220296 - 07/18/14 12:27 AM Re: Pastor Loses Job for Marrying Son [Re: jabber]
jabber Offline
Member

Registered: 02/17/05
Posts: 9984
Loc: New York State
Anne...

Just re read what I wrote. Never said God is vengeful. I said He died on a cross for all sins, for all time. He paid for the world's sins with His own blood and suffering! I said God is love. God is good.

In Romans 1: 26 & 27 scene, God doesn't punish them. They destroy themselves.

But IMHO outside of the 10 Commandments are humans' really smart enough to discern God's actions or reactions?

_________________________
"MOLLIE'S FOLLIES" by Bonnie Mill-Lemke, aka Jabber, is available at the Kindle Store and in paperback on Amazon.com.

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