Why do the Wicked Prosper?

Posted by: Anonymous

Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 10/18/10 01:15 PM

The Bible addresses this question in Psalm 73:

“A psalm of Asaph. Surely God is good to Israel, to those who are pure in heart. But as for me, my feet had almost slipped; I had nearly lost my foothold. For I envied the arrogant when I saw the prosperity of the wicked. They have no struggles; their bodies are healthy and strong. They are free from the burdens common to man; they are not plagued by human ills.” 12 “This is what the wicked are like . . . always carefree, they increase in wealth. Surely in vain have I kept my heart pure; in vain have I washed my hands in innocence. All day long I have been plagued; I have been punished every morning.”

I've found myself not always following God's law, rather man's law, much like the wicked. Yet, God knows my heart and I often find myself punished; whereas, other wicked folk continue to prosper.

Why, then, do evil people, who make no pretense of believing in the Lord, receive blessings which appear to be from God while I have to pinch every penny?

And, what about those who profess to be Christians; yet, are not and simply hide behind the robe of religeon?
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 10/18/10 02:41 PM

Good questions Mustang. I've found myself asking these questions
many, many times. Where is God when good people suffer? Why aren't the evil people punished? What about the idea: No good
deed goes unpunished? I don't understand any of this. And these certainly shake a person's faith. But I've made a decision to
believe [God is a Good God]; He loves us. And He will bring justice whre justice is due, in due time. I've decided to believe it may look like the bad guys have gotten away with their evilness, but God will get 'em!
Posted by: Di

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 10/18/10 03:15 PM

Greed. And it's short-loved....only on earth. But believers' treasures are in heaven...eternally!

And remember; the bible says that it's easier for a camel to go thru the eye of a needle than it is for a rich man to get to heaven.
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 10/19/10 12:38 PM

I know the Bible says that, Di. But it's generally the guys
without a dime, who commit such horrible crime. And the Bible
also tells us that God wants to bless His people. He came into the world, so we might enjoy the life He died to give us. But sometimes people who are not blessed, become jealous of those
who are. Then those who are down and out commit unspeakable crimes to snatch what doesn't belong to them. I guess you're right. We're back to greed!
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 10/19/10 01:01 PM

I've met so many rich and greedy folk working at law firms. I see how law firms can take someone's soul and slander their good name. Just b/c someone has an 'Esquire' behind their name does mean honor.
Posted by: Anne HolmesAdministrator

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 10/29/10 03:49 AM

I see what you are saying, Mustang, but I can't hang all the greed on lawyers - despite that famous Shakespearean quote that says, "First kill all the lawyers..."

(Aside: Here is an interesting essay on that quote from a law firm: Kill all the lawyers)

I have experienced knowing/having to work with dishonorable, rich and greedy people in all walks of life - lawyers don't have a lock on greed.

The only way I have been able to come to terms with this is the same thing that was mentioned by others in this thread: They will get theirs in the end. Meanwhile, I will live by my own standards, and sleep well at night. And so will you...
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 11/06/10 03:50 PM

Me too. I do what's right. And I sleep great! Those who've done
wrong, I hope they never sleep!!!

That's not nice, but people should leave other folks' alone and let 'em enjoy their time here on earth.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 11/09/10 04:26 PM

I couldn't agree more with ya Jabber!
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/05/10 12:29 PM

To answer the question, "Why do the Wicked Prosper?" Even the
religious icons don't have any answer to this. I heard Joyce
Meyer say the other day, "She doesn't know why God allows war,
child abuse, and evildoing." She's been studying the Bible for
decades. And so have Il but I don't have the answer.
Posted by: celtic_flame

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/18/10 03:22 AM

i don't have the answeres and i don't have to have them.

i hope god dose't get em, becouse thats not gods place surley, thats a human construct of justice?
threads jumping about between material greed, people starving and without a penny being driven to do eveil acts, so greed or the need to eat or jst being human and tempted.

in truth i not sure god even notises who's got what becouse a good busness idea is a good bussness idea regardless of the human hart. i know my hart aint sant like enough to be considered clean enough for god and i not sure i know enough people who's harts are sant like.....

......glass houses and stones springs to mind....

i do know the world aint faire and i still belive thats a humane being type thing and not a god type thing that makes a destinction to who get good materially and who won't. that logic would have you belive that aragently the rich are the true good peoplebecouse they deserve to bve financally becouse thir good. its kinda self fullfiling argument and even the rotten apples be sitting thincking thir harts are good enough becouse god allows them thir riches.

in life ya meet all sorts of people its just important that we aint the ones covered in sin, of envey or lust, or hatting the rich or just hating anybody.

the only logic too it i can find is god just dose't govern who gets what in life, we do and we are also respoonsible for how we get it in life, thats our mane bussness. How good a person we have been and how filled our harts are with warmth love and compasion and how often we act that out in life and in the deepest bits of our harts is how i think, hope god judges us. and when we fail becouse we all will at some point in our life that god will be mercifull and just in his mercy.

i canb't work it out that anything else falls too some type of judment or punishment thats not about or based on love comming into play.
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/18/10 11:29 PM

Celtic,
I like your signature. I'll say it again, "It's hard being human." God's ways are impossible for us to understand. And I guess we shouldn't even try. I've seen good people beaten down and nasty people thriving. That's life! Guess we shouldn't try to figure it out!
Posted by: Edelweiss3

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/19/10 01:25 PM

Aaah Celtic is back again, with her interesting thoughts and philosophies. I missed those conversations.

Mustang you titled this thread;
Quote:
Why do the wicked prosper?

On the other side of the coin; - you certainly don’t have to be wicked to prosper. Thanks to many prosperous folks, a lot of poor people are being helped. Millions are poured into funds by the rich…Take Bill Gates for example and his club of millionaires.

In all of us, poor, rich, black or white, in all of us is a soul. In that respect we are all alike. We will all die and our souls will go somewhere peaceful and beautiful beyond our dreams. What happens down here, on earth, is just an interval. We have to simply make the best of it, - or not. Of course many don’t have a chance from birth on. Their release is when they die sooner than most of us and suffer no more.

I know you are having an incredibly hard time, Mustang. I am not in the position to see where the problem lies. All I can suggest is; - try a new strategy. If you keep pushing the same buttons nothing will change. I’m sort of in a slump what my own profession is concerned. I need to change my own strategy and adjust as to how the market has changed. Internet is the biggest competition for me. Many home owners simply present their homes on internet portals, not needing a realtor anymore. I simply know it won’t help if I keep running on the same treadmill; - thus I’m actively searching alternatives before it’s too late.

You and I know that being rich or poor has nothing to do with religion. I think we all have been tuned to believe; “being naughty shall be punished”.

Let’s just leave the bible aside for a moment, and imagine that just won’t happen. Isn’t it possible that everything in our lives, things we have done; - good or bad, will just pop like a bubble when we die? It just doesn’t matter how we behaved. Our lives here are just a tiny part of what is to come. Imagine that an element of us will never die; - the soul within us. We aren’t really all that unique. Instead, we are all part of one puzzle; the universe,( that doesn't have to mean there is no God), which we all share together in endless time.

So, if you believe that, like I do; then the life we have here is not about justice, rewards or punishments. It’s just about making the best of it, and enjoying moments that we have the privilege to experience. Right, that won’t get the food on the table, but getting that food on the table, can be a rewarding experience as well. If you aren’t able to do that, then your life plan must be changed, which leads us back to step one.
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/20/10 02:39 PM

Edelweiss,
I agree with most of what you said in this last post, except the
line: "It just doesn't matter how we behaved." It matters in the
sense that some people go out of their way to destroy others'
lives. And that's wrong. We should, like The Bill Gates group, go out of our way to help our fellow man enjoy life. Not because we're trying to earn stars in our crown, but because it's the right thing to do. Lying about people and destroying their reputation 'n life, is wrong. And bad people should be stopped.
If God is a God of Justice, shouldn't He do something to stop it and protect the people who love Him and live in a righteous manner?
Posted by: Mountain Ash

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/20/10 03:43 PM

Do the wicked prosper ?
Posted by: Edelweiss3

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/20/10 05:48 PM

Jabber, that’s just the point. Of course our behaviour matters here on earth. Those with a conscience generally don’t treat others wrongly. And those with a conscience, who have done harm to others, are punished by living with such a burden. But believing that we will be punished or rewarded when we die; - no I don’t believe that.

Punishment for doing wrong things are a man made indoctrination. What we may consider bad or good may not be so in another culture.

You asked;
Quote:
If God is a God of Justice, shouldn't He do something to stop it and protect the people who love Him and live in a righteous manner?
I think your question is also the answer. God can't be a God of justice. If he were , then why is there so much injustice? I believe when we die, we return to where we were before we were born. Our souls live and always will, and that we are all equal as souls.

I wonder if this is some sort of religion allready? In any case, I’m not following any religion nor have I been influenced by any readings. My own thoughts and visions have lead me to this belief.

One way or another, it’s always better for ourselves and for others to be as good as we can be.
On that I agree with you.
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/20/10 09:09 PM

Edelweiss,
Yes. I guess we agree in a lot of areas. I don't follow any
structured religion either. I believe in God. I believe in Heaven. But as far as man made rules I have trouble believing in
so-called experts. More than not, I've found the "experts" don't know what they're talking about and if two agree on any one subject, it's a wonder.

MA,
Some wicked prosper physically, now and again, but never spiritually! IMO!
Posted by: meredithbead

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/21/10 01:03 AM

Edelweiss, interesting thoughts.

Quite a few religions believe that out souls are immortal, and this body and life are just temporary way stations designed to teach us what we need to know for ascension. Some believe in reincarnation -- what we don't learn in this lifetime, we'll return & hopefully get it right next go-round.

The wicked obviously need to learn a hard lesson next time -- have a more difficult life, etc. -- which, of course, doesn't help the people they've screwed over in this life. Then, I realize many of you don't believe in reincarnation, so "he'll get his next time" really doesn't have meaning.

There are righteous people of all faiths, and of no faith. Same goes for wicked.
Posted by: Anne HolmesAdministrator

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/21/10 01:07 AM

Welcome back, Celtic!! We missed you!
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/22/10 02:51 PM

Divine,
I agree with your assessment wholeheartedly!
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/26/10 12:36 AM

Guess, the tough part for me is knowing that people do exists to harm others whether rich or poor, their intent is to purposefully harm another. To purposefully inflict pain upon another for pleasure is evil. I see this
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/26/10 02:20 PM

Let's hope and pray the evildoers get theirs; and the good folks
excel in all they do.
Posted by: celtic_flame

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/26/10 11:44 PM

yea hellow ladies and ann.............

i am not so sure i said much diffrent from any of the rest of you but perhapps my way of putting it dowen might be diffrent or my examples are diffrent but mostly I said the same as most and thats simply material gain and goodness or rightchness ise't always so clear cut. ........but i am also good with you thinking it was diffrent at its core but i aint not so sure it is diffrent.

Meridith how do you reachone the karma balance is regulated if considerring reincarnasion? goood deads get rewarded with a better life in the next life. dose it ever go the opposite way.......a real hard life is the rewared for the previouse life success at overcomming adversity? how dose it address poverty striken cultures and is thir ever a risk that us in our developed wealth get arrogant over the less developed cultures? Dose it all pice together?

i not so sure i care about anyone getting thir punishment for whickied they have done, i not suure punishment stops the behaviour. maybee some love compasion and guidance teaches a corrective way to do something but the cold hard bitter sting of adversity is hard to imagine bringing about a more loving life rather than storeing up bitterness and bile.


jabber, id really rather have the folks that do whicked things in life be stoppped and corrected through love than punishment, i just think it works better, well it dose so with kids and adults we'r just a bitmore sofisticated kids lol.

mustange if your starting this chat in response to somthhing happening in life right now that your witnessing whickedness and prosperity and it shaking your faith then i am sorry. I know you know what its like to see the "good" church going ladies that gossipe and backbite and prosper and i rember that being a tough thing to witness.

i know i am just repeating myself but i don't think god bothers with that stuff as he/she be more intrested in whats going on inside us in relasion to our lifes no matter to how hard or easie it is.

I just hope your not soar over it as thats when it starts effecting our owen spirituality. Keep strong regardless of whatts going on in life, and i hope you don't get pulled over to any side becouse of it. just be true to yourself and you'll be doing well.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/27/10 02:05 AM

Celtic Flame, welcome back yee wonderful gal!

This has been an interesting conversation and I love everyone's honesty -- thank you for that.

Yes, Celtic, my faith -- what little I have left, I'm ashamed to say -- has been shaken. I've seen people with the most evilist of intentions inflict pain upon others for their simple pleasure. People who hide behind the law, their degrees, the Church, government, those in positoins of authority, neighbors, etc., who have purposefully inflicted pain upon me and others with malice.

I often wonder what is God's purpose for evil folk?
Posted by: Mountain Ash

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/27/10 11:18 AM

Celtic you say

"i not so sure i care about anyone getting thir punishment for whickied they have done, "

I agree in fact I believe that its not in my hands or thoughts to punish wittingly another human being.
My aim and mindset is to analyse why someone acts disrespecfully for my own peace of mind and growth.To aim for the ability to rise above and go peacefully about my life.Never to feed the fire of someone elses discontent or anger.Leaving them in time to work out an answer to their hostility.I just dont give my energy to unkind acts.
I respect I have never been homeless or hungry so maybe have never been tested.
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/27/10 01:05 PM

MA,
I like that. Take the high road and let "God" be God; let HIM avenge whatever is wrong with the world.
Posted by: Mountain Ash

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/27/10 01:17 PM

No Jabber
I did not mention God..
and avenge is not in my vocabulary.
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/27/10 07:24 PM

Guess that was my interpretation. Humans are complicated folks.
And we all see everything so differently. When you said it wasn't in your hands, I assumed you meant it was in the hands
of a higher power. Sorry for misunderstanding. And I still don't think anyone has the right to ruin another's life and get off
scotfree. This point of view is speaking from experience, not abstract expressionism.
Posted by: Mountain Ash

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/27/10 10:05 PM

Nor do I think anyone has the right to ruin anothers life.
Posted by: yonuh

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/27/10 11:21 PM

I think hoping and praying for someone to 'get theirs' is the same is taking revenge on someone. A philosopher once said that before you set out on a journey of revenge, dig two graves. People who focus on someone else's bad behavior and worry about whether they will be punished are only hurting themselves, in my opinion. I prefer to ignore people who behave badly. I can't control what they do; I can only control how I react. I prefer to focus on what I CAN do, not on what I can't control.

I also agree that it's wrong for anyone to ruin someone else. But when that happened to me, there was nothing I could do except continue to live my life and prove them wrong. It took several years, but I came out better than before when the person was spreading lies about me. There were times when I was angry, but I never once thought about revenge because I know what that can do to a person.
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/27/10 11:29 PM

I'm letting THE MAN upstairs even the score, ladies. I'm not
focusing on it in length, because my friend is in her grave; I'd rather be on this side of the equation than the other. The title of this thread has been a question asked down through the ages.
And it's worth stepping back and having a look. You can't just
shrug every distasteful situation off, like it isn't there. I don't see anything wrong in airing one's feelings, now and again. What say you?
Posted by: Eagle Heart

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/28/10 01:46 PM

This reminds me of something I read years ago that has become so ingrained in me. It was by Jean Vanier and I can't quote word for word, so will just give the gist of it. Essentially, he suggested that in every moment of our lives and in every encounter with every person we meet, we either sow seeds of death or seeds of life. We are constantly choosing, by our thoughts, actions, words and non-actions, to either sow seeds of darkness and death - or seeds of light and life. There's no in-between.

Thoughts of vengeance lead to actions, words and a general demeanor which support those thoughts and those beliefs of vengeance...more darkness in a world that needs more light.

People have hurt me, hurt others, rippled devastating consequences into my life that have created painful rubble that I've had to stumble over in order to move on. I've learned that keeping grudges, wishing for vengeance, praying that others will get what I think they deserve (not in a good way), are all seeds of death and create dark and destructive forces WITHIN ME, leading me further and deeper into despair.

When I forgive and let go, asking God to BLESS those people (in a good way) according to His will for their lives, and to teach me the golden nuggets of wisdom and learning that always exist within every situation, good and bad, then I am living in light and sowing seeds of life, both within myself, and in the lives of those others.

The Bible is very clear, though again I cannot quote, about God laying before us death or life, and then exhorting us to choose life. Choosing life means choosing to live lives of forgiveness, compassion and love, even and especially for those who hurt us.

That's (IMO) what being a Christian is supposed to be about - not seeking vengeance (which only adds more darkness and death to our own hearts and in turn to anyone and everyone we encounter), but seeking forgiveness and reconciliation and sowing seeds of life and light wherever we can.

I have to say that it is beyond my comprehension to ever even think about asking God to hurt anyone for any reason! To use prayer and God in that way is abhorrent to me. My heart and spirit yearns for peace and yearns for more light and love in the world - that yearning leads me to use prayer to ask God to bless, heal, encourage, strengthen and help others in whatever way those others need, including all who hurt me or others.
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/29/10 02:54 PM

Eagle,
You are right. And I didn't mean to suggest I was praying for the Almighty to avenge their wrongdoing; I felt that way at first, but have since come to my senses. Probably after airing the situation here. I'm just letting Heaven deal with it all. I don't intend to get even for anything that went awry in my friend's life. She told me she didn't handle the situation properly. She knew that. So I guess it was her humanness that stumbled and started the avalanche, which destroyed her. I know the Bible tells us to pray for our enemies' blessings and when we do, etc., etc. I fell into this mess innocently and hope to fall out of it innocently. But I'm human, too. And it hurts to see such wonderful people unnecessarily harmed to the point of destruction. But everything you've gently stated is true. And I agree but still believe God is a God of justice, and He'll take care of it!!!
Hope you're feeling better. Delighted to hear the good news about
your Good News!!!
Posted by: meredithbead

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/30/10 08:55 AM

Quote:
Meridith how do you reachone the karma balance is regulated if considerring reincarnasion? goood deads get rewarded with a better life in the next life. dose it ever go the opposite way.......a real hard life is the rewared for the previouse life success at overcomming adversity? how dose it address poverty striken cultures and is thir ever a risk that us in our developed wealth get arrogant over the less developed cultures? Dose it all pice together?


Celtic, I have no absolute answers, but some (although not all) of the Hindu beliefs regarding reincarnation resonate with me.

Having wealth is not a crime of the soul, and as such wouldn't be punished. However, gaining wealth through the suffering of others; or using wealth to harm another -- would be.

Why do so many people live in poverty and have hard lives? I don't know. Are they being punished for past life transgressions? I don't know.

When I look, I can imagine a rhythm to all this -- discord as much as sweetness. Ebb and flow. But that's my belief system.
Posted by: yonuh

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/30/10 02:54 PM

Some Native Americans believe that we are here to learn something and to teach something. And our souls have a choice to take this life or not, knowing how it will play out. From that, I think a soul could choose a hard life knowing it will teach someone else. Once the soul inabits a body, though, it does not remember what will happen in the life it chose (usually, anyway, although some seem to remember what's coming.)
Posted by: Eagle Heart

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/30/10 03:10 PM

Yonuh, I read a book years ago (Embraced by the Light) about a woman who had a near-death experience and that's what she learned in her NDE. Her book changed my life forever, because so much of it resonated with me and made so much more sense than anything else I've ever read or learned. Embracing the possibility of these teachings has given me a whole new perspective and joy when reading Scripture, and a new sense of purpose...a profound relief, so to speak, because everything - every encounter, every experience, every perceived failure is actually a unique opportunity to either learn or teach...there are golden nuggets of wisdom and learning in every moment, when/if we have the eyes to see.

Over time, as I've read more about this, it has also (I believe) healed me of all suicidal thinking (which I've struggled with since the mid 60's). While I still have down days, deep down inside of me, I can feel a profound serenity that was never there before, a "peace that passes all understanding", because now I believe more than ever that everything, even those "down days", have opportunities for growth and stretching and hopefully, helping someone else. This way of thinking excites me like nothing else has for a long time.
Posted by: Mountain Ash

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 12/31/10 09:57 AM

It is my belief that we all reach a "place" that sits well with our own journey.For some it is a book other have an experience that allows personal growth.
I too have read books Eagle similar to the one you mention.

Meeting many people who are troubled through my career there often presents a mindset of turmoil...presents as health problems or inablilty to maintain significant riendships..sometimes manifests as sadness and sometimes anger...in most cases there has to be a turning point before a client finds ther "place"
So for me being vengenful has no value and erodes well being.
It demands practice and is as important as exercise and good food.
Posted by: 49erDonna

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/01/11 02:22 AM

I agree with you Mountain Ash,

I see no point in being vengeful and have recently been reading an article about the power of positive thinking. I read Norman Vincent Peale many years ago and firmly believe in his beliefs.

I wish several family members would hang on to the positive rather than the negaative..

How do you influence others to see the positive??

Donna
Posted by: Mountain Ash

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/01/11 12:10 PM

Donna
There are none so blind as those who do not want to see.

Each person has the ability to seek their own conclusion.In novels..plays as in life there is a "turning point"

but illness is I believe connected to mind set...so internal work has to be done.
Posted by: Eagle Heart

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/01/11 01:49 PM

So wise, MA. My journey has been so full of twists and turns that it has taken many "turning points" to get to my here-and-now. I suspect that there will need to be more, because there is still much internal work to be done. I think, believe, that these life-changing turning points come just as one needs them to move into the next chapter of that inner work. It seems that it's a never-ending process, though perhaps that's because I choose to keep searching out what I need to heal the parts of me that are still broken (eg, I still have trouble establishing and maintaining relationships).

I keep hoping that one day I will stumble over the threshold into perfect inner harmony, where all of these turning points and healings will join together into one harmonious web of well-being and inner peace - what I want most, my constant prayer, is always to learn how to love and to be loved to the point where love and light are all that ripple out of my heart and mind and tongue. Perhaps that can't happen within the confines of this human form, but it's what drives me to keep moving forward and not to give in to complacency and futility (otherwise, my life would seem like intolerable drudgery at times.)
Posted by: yonuh

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/01/11 01:51 PM

I don't think you can influence others to think positively rather than negatively. All you can do is stay positive yourself and hope they follow your example. Some people just don't 'get it' and never will; others may see how well it works for you and change. Keep trying!
Posted by: Eagle Heart

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/01/11 03:10 PM

I think that others can be roadmaps to new directions if we're open to allowing their experiences and insights to teach us something. I can attest to being profoundly changed by the women here over my several years here. I have to especially give credit to JJ whose positive attitude opened my eyes to the possibility of changing my negative/depressive patterns of thinking. It took a lot of work, at first it was every moment, 24/7, being vigilant in catching the negative thoughts and then deliberately replacing them with gratitude and positive thinking.

JJ often shared about how her Mom would get up in the morning, open the curtains and greet the day with something like "Hello world!" I adopted that, and believe me, it was very hard for me to get out of bed some mornings. But I did, opened my curtains, and every morning would thank God for the beautiful new day, the beautiful tree outside my window, and for the chance to learn more wonderful things about life and love that day. It took awhile, but slowly it began to change my life. Now it's just part of my day, catching those negatives - perhaps mulling over them for a bit to discern where they're coming from - but then resolutely focusing on the lesson behind the situation, the blessing beyond the pain and the light behind the clouds.

So as you say, Yonuh, I did witness here how positive thinking and gratitude attitude worked for others, and used those wisdoms and perspectives to help change my own way of thinking and seeing the world. I like the change. There's still more to do, but I really like how far I've come, thanks to everyone here!
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/01/11 03:17 PM

We are all a "work in progress!"
Posted by: Mountain Ash

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/01/11 03:28 PM

Yonuh You say
All you can do is stay positive yourself and hope they follow your example.I agree with you.
and Eagle...I too appreciate JJ's cheerful attitude.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/11/11 02:46 AM

Albert Einstein once made a very, very important remark we ALL should never forget.

"This world is to dangerous a place to live in. Not because of all of the evil and bad around us, but because of those who sit and let it continue to happen."

Einstein's quote is similar to, in meaning, to the often quoted "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" attributed to 18th century British statesman Edmund Burke (1728 - 1797). The origin of this quote and its many variants is widely disputed and may actually be a composite from Burke's writings. Apparently there is no original. The point being the thought behind Einsteins quote is anything but new. It's been in all kinds of literature for a hundred years before he said it. He may or may not have known of it. Einstein added the guilt angle.
Posted by: yonuh

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/11/11 02:58 PM

Yes, Mustang, and sometimes silence is seen as condoning the words or deeds. It also reminds me of this:

"They came first for the Communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and by that time no one was left to speak up."
Pastor Martin Niemöller (1892–1984)
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/11/11 08:26 PM

yonuh,
On the other hand, you can speak up and get shot down when you
do so. And then you get caught in the fray!
Posted by: yonuh

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/11/11 11:23 PM

Yes, but that's a chance I'm willing to take. If enough people stand up and speak out, then things change! I will not lie down and let anyone take my rights away, and taking away the rights of any group is taking away mine. It was people like Edward R Murrow speaking out that finally stopped McCarthy from his witch hunt. I would rather stand up and fight than live in fear. I will speak my opinion, and have, and have been called unpatriotic, anti-American, and worse. But my opinion is mine, and I will not keep quiet if I see injustice.

And yes, I feel strongly about this!
Posted by: meredithbead

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/12/11 08:42 AM

Yonuh, my father repeated that quote often to me. It was a credo he lived by and taught his children: Do not turn a blind eye to injustice.
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/12/11 01:30 PM

yonuh,
I admire people who stand up for what they believe. Hope I didn't give connotations otherwise. I'm recovering from a
hectic 5 plus years; and am sitting back and licking my wounds
for a while. You go girl!
Posted by: yonuh

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/12/11 02:58 PM

I understand, jabber, that there are times when we need to take a step back and regroup. And I didn't take your words as not standing up for what you believe. Sometimes we need to be in the forefront of the battle; sometimes we can only stand behind those who are fighting and support them. We each have our own talents, and using them is the best way to work for change.
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 01/13/11 01:26 PM

Agree!
Posted by: Songbird

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 02/03/11 02:04 PM

I invite you to take a look at the entire Psalm.

Psalm 73 (Contemporary English Version)
(A psalm by Asaph.)
God Is Good

1-God is truly good to Israel, [a] especially to everyone
with a pure heart.

2-But I almost stumbled and fell,

3-because it made me jealous to see proud and evil people and to watch them prosper.

4-They never have to suffer, [b] they stay healthy,

5-and they don't have troubles like everyone else.

6-Their pride is like a necklace, and they commit sin more often than they dress themselves.

7-Their eyes poke out with fat, and their minds are flooded
with foolish thoughts.

8-They sneer and say cruel things,and because of their pride,
they make violent threats.

9-They dare to speak against God and to order others around.

10-God will bring his people back, and they will drink the water
he so freely gives. [c]

11-Only evil people would say, "God Most High cannot know everything!"

12-Yet all goes well for them, and they live in peace.

13-What good did it do me to keep my thoughts pure and refuse to do wrong?

14-I am sick all day, and I am punished each morning.

15-If I had said evil things, I would not have been loyal to your people.

16-It was hard for me to understand all this!

17-Then I went to your temple, and there I understood what will happen to my enemies.

18-You will make them stumble,never to get up again.

19-They will be terrified, suddenly swept away and no longer here.

20-They will disappear, Lord, despised like a bad dream the morning after.

21-Once I was bitter and brokenhearted.

22-I was stupid and ignorant, and I treated you as a wild animal would.

23-But I never really left you, and you hold my right hand.

24-Your advice has been my guide, and later you will welcome me
in glory. [d]

25In heaven I have only you, and on this earth you are all I
want.

26-My body and mind may fail, but you are my strength and my
choice forever.

27-Powerful LORD God, all who stay far from you will be lost, and you will destroy those who are unfaithful.

28-It is good for me to be near you. I choose you as my protector, and I will tell about your wonderful deeds.

Blessings!

Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 02/03/11 02:27 PM

Songbird,
I've read this often and others like it. Some scriptures are so
contradictory. In one place it says to pray for those who do
you wrong, heaping coals on their head, or some such thing.
And in many other places I've read how God protects those who
love Him and He'll right the wrong done to those who love Him. I believe "God is Good"; He's more than Good, He's great, awesome, and wonderful! Thanks for the above post!
Posted by: chatty lady

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 03/07/11 12:16 AM

I too believe in a fair and just God. I am confused by the teaching of Born Again Christians that say God will forgive
anyone that profess's sorrow and his belief in God at the end of their life. This includes child molesters and killers, and all sort of heinois criminals. In the Catholic church I was taught you suffered for your sins in purgatory and then went to heaven or if bad enough you died and went straight to hell to burn for eternity. How can someone like say Ted Bundy or Jeffrey Dawmer or John Wayne Gasey have as much a chance at heaven as someone say like me, who never hurt anyone, human nor animal and has always believed in living a good life; believing in God and his commandments??? Any takers???
Posted by: jabber

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 04/06/11 10:18 AM

I don't understand this either. Never have. Never will!
Posted by: chatty lady

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 05/04/11 10:07 PM

Not surprising to me no one but one person had an snswer for this subject!! Good question just the same.
Posted by: Dianne

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 06/01/11 04:23 PM

Chatty, maybe God looks at the sinner differently than we do?
Posted by: Anne HolmesAdministrator

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 06/01/11 05:04 PM

Chatty, I try to avoid religious discussions with Born Again Christians, so I don't have an answer for you, either.

I believe that there is one God, who goes by all the names the different religions give to Him.

I believe He is just and fair, and that all people can be saved by his Grace. This means we can all be forgiven for our transgressions and atone for our sins. But I am under the impression that the evil people in the world have to do a lot more "atoning" before they can get to Heaven.

Beyond that, I leave the details up to God.
Posted by: Songbird

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 06/01/11 06:56 PM

John 3:16 tells us that Jesus died, that whosoever believes in Him, shall not perish, but have everlasting life. It is good news that if we sincerely repent of our wrongdoings and turn away from them, God forgives us.

As I understand what I've read in the Bible, the reward for believing in God will be the same regardless of the amount of time we served Him. If a 10 yr. old gives his heart to Jesus, and lives a Godly life his reward will be the "same" as for the 70 year old who accepts Jesus as a Savior in the winter of his life: Eternal life is what God promised. I hope this helps.

The wicked seem to prosper, but eventually, if there is no repentance, they will perish. We decide our eternal future by the daily choices we make. Let us live with that in mind and be a light and an inspiration to others.
Posted by: yonuh

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 06/01/11 11:30 PM

Parable of the Vineyard Workers; no matter how long one 'works' or in this case, believes, the reward is the same.
Posted by: Eagle Heart

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 06/02/11 02:35 AM

I didn't respond, Chatty, because I already know how you will feel about my answer. I passionately believe that there is no such thing as anyone being "beyond redemption". I don't have the time, wisdom, energy or inclination to judge anyone anywhere for anything...I have enough to tend to in my own heart and choices. It's enough for me that God knows all, knows the heart of each person and knows all the "why's" of their lives and choices...He created even those you would condemn and He calls each one His son or His daughter...I've experienced His mercy first-hand. And I trust His ability to deal with anyone anyway He chooses.
Posted by: Eagle Heart

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 06/02/11 02:42 AM

You probably also won't like what I'm about to share...I suppose I'm going to get a lot of negative flak...while so many were celebrating, my very first instinct and thought at the news that Bin Laden had been killed was to pray for him and ask God to forgive him...the words just instinctively without hesitation filled my heart and mind. I could not, and hope to God I never will be able to, celebrate the killing of any human being. I will be honest, and admit to being hopeful that his death might bring respite from his level of terrorism in the western world, but I still could not "celebrate" or feel happy about someone being killed.
Posted by: Anne HolmesAdministrator

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 06/02/11 03:16 AM

Thanks for sharing your point of view, Eagle Heart. I don't have a problem with your actions when you heard bin Laden was killed. Everyone handles news their own way, and as far as I can recall, there's nothing in the Bible that says we can't pray for our enemies.

In fact, doesn't Matthew 5:44 advise us to do so? Here's a link to a site with a number of translations of that verse: Bible Commentary
Posted by: Dianne

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 06/04/11 05:36 PM

You know, the theory that the wicked prosper just isn't true. Not every evil person is happy, rich or prosperous. There are millions of good people who have prospered as well.

Eagle, I too felt sadness that Bin Laden died never knowing the beauty of love.
Posted by: Songbird

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 06/07/11 06:58 PM

I agree with Dianne: not every evil person is happy.
But at times it does seem that those who have no concern for human life or for the rights of others, etc., prosper. And we see many who are responsible, caring persons struggling with afflictions (illness, financial hardship, injustice and other issues). That's why David's Psalm talks about it.

On the other hand,only God knows the motives and true intentions of our heart and what drives each of us to act the way we do. We are not capable of judging them correctly and that is not our calling.

I agree with Eagle: I do feel sad that people die without ever knowing or experiencing love. God loves each person and regardless of their wrongdoings, I believe we should respect life. He is the giver of life. Each day he gives us is an opportunity to choose to live for Him or choose to live selfishly for our own purposes.
Posted by: Anonymous

Re: Why do the Wicked Prosper? - 06/08/11 01:43 AM

Songbird, I understand -- yet, it can be such a selfish world in which to find intrinisic value. I agree that God's path is best and often the toughest.