Humiliation still haunts me...

Hi, friends,
I know I'm doing all the "right" things...pursuing my MA degree in Fine Art, abstaining from putting myself "out there" again in the dating arena (thus avoiding another fiasco), but I'm still haunted by the humiliation I felt after my last attempt at forming an intimate relationship.
Over and over in my mind, I've asked myself, considering how attracted I was to the man, what I could or should have done differently. First, I was to eager and vulnerable in the sexual aspect, no doubt, because of my previous three year abstinence from it! Second, I should have taken time to get to know the man better, thus, discerning if he was someone who would value me and treat me as I deserve to be treated.
I haven't dated since this disaster, and it still haunts me! Such things don't pass easily at age 55. I will NEVER place myself in such a vulnerable position again. I admit, I'm still dealing with the humiliation of it all.
Need to move on???? Of course I do.
Any suggestions are welcomed!
ARI

Ariadne, Any suggestion you say well it sounds a bit like wallowing to me and its time you just let it go, get on with it, the past is the past if you'll let go of it. We have been over this and over this with you. Seems to be the only thing on your mind when posting. Try this site for some different ideas...www.solobliss.com

I've seen Solobliss...it's a shallow site.
Once again, Chatty has put me in my place and tells me I do not belong here on this forum!

I don't think she meant that, Ari. I think she's encouraging you to find some peace in not being half of a couple. She knows that a woman can have a happy and fulfilling life w/o a man.

Oh for pity sake Ariadne you ask for advice then you either ignore it or turn it into some other kind of pity party for yourself, really!!! I happen to like solo bliss and thought you might get a chuckle out of it and some of the other women on that sites ideas. Sorry I bothered and you can be sure it won't happen again.

Chatty (and Bluebird)...
I think Chatty is being too judgemental, and I wonder if she has ever really "LOVED!"
I posted a very personal reflection here and got shut down immediately by Chatty for "wallowing."
Didn't Chatty say she makes her "living" by talking to men on the Internet? What a way to go!
Clearly I have no place here.
ARI

Oh brother here we go again....I LOVED and lost my first husband after only five short years of marriage to Cancer, just before my son was born. I mentioned wallowing because every time you post its about that same man and your horrible experience well let me say this. After a long bout of beig alone and sad and lonely, 14 years, I fell for a man who presented himself as a savior to me, we married. We planned to wait until being married to have sex because I was in love not in LUST...Well low and behold he was the King of Scoundrels, a rat, a cheat, a man who liked very young girls. He moved into my home, my car, my bank account and never into my bed. You want to talk humiliation. Honey I could write a book on the subject. He used me, he abused every good thing I offered and he walks around today telling people I was his meal ticket, his way out of Minnesota and into Vegas. It took me seven years to get up the nerve to throw his butt out and take all the slings and arrows I knew he would send my way. But I got throuhg it, pulled myself together and made a new life or am still trying to. I help other women at a homeless shelter as well who have gone through some really horrific times, that make what I went through look like a walk in the park. Do I ever feel sorry for myself, hell yes I do but I refuse to give in to it and have only gotten stronger from all of it. Oh and I have never talked to any man on the INTERNET, if you want to "try" to insult somebody get your facts straight first. Only you know where and if you belong somewhere! I will say that if you can't take the heat stay out of the kitchen, when I ask for advice here or anywhere I am not looking just to be agreed with or felt sorry for, I find that dishonest...don't you?

[ February 22, 2006, 07:50 AM: Message edited by: chatty lady ]

Chatty,
I am respectful of your personal history, and it sounds pretty horrific. I too have a horrific history.
But...let me ask this..didn't you say that you make your income by talking to men on the Internet?
Whatever...I still think my posting a personal reflection about my own history deserved a less callous response from you. I am making headway.
Perhaps other women here can identify with my trauma rather than saying..."move on!"
ARI

Ari, some relationships just hurt more than others. Take the right ingredients and they can become obsessive. He might have been just what you wanted and needed but his whole profile was a fraud.

We all make mistakes. Lord...I'm sure I could top you in that department! It's just part of life. We should learn from them and sometimes it takes a while for the pain to go away. Just stay focused on you and his memory will fade.

No Ariadne I never speak to any man or men on the internet I don't trust or believe in those sites at all. I have friends that have had bad experiences off the internet. Its my personal preference. I said I "ONCE" made my living talking to men on the PHONE. What does that have to do with your situation anyway? Just looking for some stones to throw maybe, how small of you! If you would get out of that 'poor me' mode long enough to read what I actually said to you, I was trying to discourage you from allowing this experience to hold you down, to make you feel less that what you can be and its is a fact that you have posted about this same thing now a dozen or so times. How long is it going to take you to move on? I was encouraged when you began posting positively then you slipped right back into the same old thing again. Maybe Dianne is right and some relationships hurt more than others or maybe some of us are just more resilient, who knows? Hey don't let me discourage you, have at it, there are plenty of people that will tell you what they know you want to hear. I have to be on this thread as I am the Monitor but I will just avoid your posts that way there will be no way you can misinterpret what I've said...enjoy!

[ February 06, 2006, 10:34 PM: Message edited by: chatty lady ]

Chatty is not the only one who observed what appears to be an obsession with this man. I too made that observation when you came on here before and posted incessantly about this man. That was nearly a year ago.

I was severely chastised by you for my honesty in much the same way you are now chastising Chatty. It is hard to believe you are still obsessing about this man who you didn't really even know. You only knew what he posted on a dating site and what he told you.

Chatty is the dear Abby of this site. She tells it like she sees it and she is usually right. She has made an honest and loving observation of your situation with this man as she sees it. In return you have questioned whether she has ever loved at all. By doing so, you attacked, not her situation, but her person. And that is unacceptable.

Those of us who have benefitted from Chatty's honest advice know she speaks from her heart and that her heart is full of love. She is not always right, but she takes the time to give us all some much needed advice. She deserves, not an attack on her loving nature, but your gratitude.

Some people may post false nice words, but being nice is not always being kind. And in this case you need someone to be honest with you much more than you need niceties. No one has humiliated you. You have humiliated yourself. And you continue to do so by obsessing about this person you barely knew.

There are plenty of things to post about. And we all have problems and flaws. Everyone was delighted to read of your studies and your personal growth. But we are embarrassed for you when we read of your continued obsession with this elusive man who may actually have been nothing he represented himself to be. For your own good, take Chatt'sy advice and move on.

smile

[ February 07, 2006, 02:10 AM: Message edited by: smilinize ]

Ladies, I am surprised at the bickering going on here. Please, if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say it.

Ari, I can see why it haunts you. Especially if you waited three years and chose to trust again. I'm sure it makes you wonder why you chose to trust.

I think your post about going back to school and creating a new life is the best thing you can do for now.

The best thing to do with this bad situation is to learn from it. Onward.

Ari, I couldn't agree more with Dotsie. And, Dotsie, let me echo your comment about "bickering." Your forums are a place to encourage, empower and support one another. For some women, this might be the only safe haven they've found to share and work through their feelings and issues. Let's stay honest with each other, but let's keep it safe. A heart is a tender thing.

Thanks, Dotsie and Prill,
I've regretted posting this personal reflection about humiliation.
I do not talk about my personal feelings with any friends, male or female, in my own circle, and stepping out on a limb to do so here was, well, a mistake!
I'm not wallowing in self-pity or continuing to long for the man. The aftermath of the unfortunate experience, however, especially at my age...is truly humiliating! I have no desire to meet men now...NONE! So, truly, I am building my life based on my solitude (which is blessed and peaceful), pursuing my education (which has been neglected in the past in favor of that elusive love interest), and surveying WHY I have failed so miserably in the arena of relationships.
Yes, it takes me a LONG time! A long time to work through hurtful experiences. Call it a "pity party" if you will. I've always been this way. I look at women who are able to brush themselves off quickly and move on. I envy them, but I also recognize my own "history" and "pathology." It comes from having been severely punished and chastised as a child for the least infraction, sometimes for things I didn't even do or know I did. A counselor (female) once asked me how I ever managed to accomplish anything (education, pursuit of my art, etc.) concidering my history. I admit it has taken great effort!
Because of this last exchange, I'm thinking this is a "tea and crumpets" site for women who want to get together and give accolades and never touch on matters of the heart, much less personal struggle.
I will not post here again!
ARI

Ari, have you ever read the book The Highly Sensitive Person by Elaine Aron? It's possible you fall in to this category (not a bad thing), I know I do and some things that you wrote sound like me.
Being overly criticized as a child will make it harder for you to get over things and will cause you to beat yourself up more than you should. Been there...

ariadne, I sent you a PM.

I just came upon this thread. Wish I had before.

Chatty, I'm sure you mean well, but not everyone is as you are. Often your posts seem harsh - even tho your intent is of the best of heart....Take observance. Some of the best people take affront at your remarks. I know you don't mean to make this a place where you are unforgiving....But sometimes it seems so. We are in a "virtual" world here, and cannot know of all that has transpired in someone's life. I ask you to be a little more forgiving in that respect. I am trying to be understanding, but I fear I am more angry with you than otherwise....I surely have my own reasons for being staunch and concrete about issues, but I hope that I can give someone the latitude that he/she needs to grow and become the person that they desire to be. This should be a place where women can come, to get support and to be uplifted. Not to be condemned for their failures. I have surely had mine, and don't imagine that anyone else has had none.

In short, be a little more forgiving, Chat. And you too, Smile. I am not without blame in any instance, but can't we be sisters in this endeavor, and support each other, even if we disagree?

This post was over and done with and PMs sent and the air cleared but then you wouldn't have known this and dredged it back up again for some reason, not sure why....Mind telling me just how I am preveived by YOU since not everyone is as "I am"?? I am unsue what you mean also about some of the "best people" I was not aware we were divided into classes of best and less than best?? Weather I am forgiving or not about anyones posts should not matter at all, I am no one important here, just one of the crowd. I ask a question of you, "are we to ignore any post where a women asks for an HONEST reply if that reply MIGHT seem harsh to someone else but yet is something she needs to hear?" Harsh to some is no more than honesty to others. In another post today on another thread a woman referred to me as "trash mouthed" because I use to do phone fantasy work and and as "sexually dried up" because I am post menopausal. Whats that???
I got totally pissed off but yet chose to ignore her remarks because she is obviously a man lover and against all women in her comments. Was she being harsh, maybe but I prefer to see those remarks as small minded and stupid. Did I make a big deal of them, NO of course not! She is as entitled to her opinion as anyone and was being honest in her own way. I do not pussy foot around the truth as I see it. I do try to be helpful when telling the truth (as I see it)I have NEVER attacked anyone personally, ever. But hey if a woman doesn't want everyones opinion true or nicey nice then she shouldn't open herself up to those opinions by asking for them. I agree Searcher, none of us is without failures in our lives and I think you and maybe some others put too much importance not in what I say but the way you preceive I say it. I am trying to be less direct/honest and I skirt around the issues more making my comments casual. When and if this becomes a problem to my self respect I will cease to contribute at all...making some of you "best" people happy I'm sure.....

[ February 20, 2006, 09:55 PM: Message edited by: chatty lady ]

I need to post an update here. I said I would not post here again, but things have transpired in my efforts at recovery, and these things also may be enlightening to some, though obviously, not ALL women here.

One of the reasons I had lingered in getting better and "moving on" is that I had continued to hear from the man, though infrequently. I heard from him again about a week ago. I was on the computer and an IM popped up from him. I was shocked to be contacted in that way, but I did talk to him briefly, during which time he said he'd been "looking at my pictures and thought it would be nice to see me." I responded only that I'm very tired and immersed in my studies, and excused myself after a few brief exchanges. After that, I found myself thinking about him once again, feeling vulnerable.

The mind is a curious thing. The overriding emotion I have had about the experience with this man has been humiliation. Yet, in my thinking, I was unable to acknowledge how truly BAD it was, how shabbily I was treated by him! Over the past year since the relationship, I've done lots of healing work on myself, but simply couldn't face the reality of it.

Something happened in my thinking over the past weekend, and I faced it. I guess I had enough time and distance to do so, and facing it and acknowledging it to myself. Accepting that, yes, it truly was humiliating.

As for the option of seeing the man again, my thoughts are now, "What was all the hard work of recovery about???" To open myself up to another chance to be hurt and humiliated? I can say an emphatic NO!!! to this. I turn my back on it now freely and happily, accepting a hard lesson learned.

This is my only forum, and a great one with strong and inspiring women. I'll post in other threads as time permits!

Love to you all!
ARI

Chatty,

I have never known you to be "trashed mouthed" - and have not seen such a post. (it would make me angy to see it) And "dried up" would surely include myself and is a nasty way to describe any woman. You are more than entitled to your opinions, Chat, and I for one, am glad you have them. But I , whether "nicey nice" or not, believe that we can achieve a better understanding of one another by being just a little more forgiving....I truly understand that you were trying to be helpful in your statesments, by telling the truth as you see it - believing that honesty will help the afflicted - but , Chatty, if you alienate the person you're trying to help, is it helping? I don't necessarily disagree with you on this point, but I am saying, can we do this with a little more gentility and sensitivity? I have been a stupid idiot on many occasions in my life, and if someone had bombed me with the unmitigated truth at the time, I might have just gone under cover and never emerged again. WE can only be where we are at....

To make my point - if I had insisted upon Boa Kitty getting into my lap earlier than he was ready, he might never have done it. But instead, I waited until he was ready....And today, He did it!!!! All on his own! Ready to make the leap to believe I would not abuse him, but love him instead......And this took 5 years. But worth every minute....I am glad to know you, Chatty, I am just asking that you be as patient with your human friends as you are with your animal ones.....(tho I realize that animal ones can most often be more kind).....

Search

Chatty,
I think a lot of us on this forum who have been on sense Dotsie started this have cease to contribute , for people posting negative remarks about other people on this forum and some of us have had it. We will lash back and defend ourselves and give our opionion . We have that right as well as anyone else does on here.
We won't be silent .Name calling is childs play. What was the reason for bringing up this thread for one last comment I wonder!

Well, I read the post where Chatty was called a trash mouth . It was there in plain English .

My thought maybe it is in the works to get some of us run off.Sad , but true.

[ February 21, 2006, 01:39 PM: Message edited by: Renee ]

Well my name wasn't used but the inference was quite plain and to the point and you know what I hate to admit it but I was talking trash. Plain and simple for the paycheck and no other reason.
But as far as being sexually dried up because of being postmenopausal that is just plain untrue and mean spirited. Some of the sexiest women I know are postmenopausal. I want to defend the other women who this person accused of being the reason their husbands cheated, strayed or watched porn. What a ridiculous statement that is and yes some women are cold or manipulating and use sex as a weapon to club their hubands but they are not the norm. In my own case my ex has a serious problem, he likes very young girls and he had been in counseling for many years before we even met, something he never bothered to tell me. He was sure his love for me would kill his addiction but alas it did not. Go figure, and me so over sexed, trashy mouthed and old to boot, LOL.....

[ February 20, 2006, 11:04 PM: Message edited by: chatty lady ]

Oh, Chatty,

I don't like to hear you talk like this. I think you are a beautiful woman - having never seen you. You are obviously a person who cares in the most true sense of this word....And I wish that we could be friends in that same true sense -- I honestly don't know how I came up with this thread - I was just perusing the forums and found it. It was not intentional in the least. In fact, I'm confounded myself. But then I often am, as I'm not very savvy about these things....I should still be considered a "schmuck" about the internet!!!! As far as your ex is concerned, he sounds like a pedophile, or at least a person who needs some really intense help. That's a real problem and so sad.

Well, look, Chatty, I'm here to make amends, and to see your point of view - I just hate that you and I can't see our way out of this - . I just think that with conversation, we can fix an enormous amount of dissention. Be it between you and I , or between, Nations.....

Search

Hmmm...I haven't been here and am not following all this talk about "trash mouth," etc.
I have to admit, harsh as it was and hurful, that maybe Chatty's chastizement of me caused me to start thinking about how LONG it was taking me to move on. Regaredless...it takes as long as it takes! In this case, it has taken a year of my precious time. I ceased posting about this a year ago because after only a week or so of posting my original experience with the man, Chatty was telling me, "Get over it, move on!" Would that it have been so easy! I would truly have welcomed such a rapid recovery!

I brought this emotional hardship on myself, acting irresponsibly. I have learned a valuable lesson. Chatty's feedback may have been harsh, but hers as well as all the other feedback here have been helpful. Yes, I've responded defensively, but I have also given thought to all the responses, including Chatty's!

As I said in my previous post, the mind is a curious thing. Though I have always felt I was able to face truths, in this case I've lived in denial, out of emotional and mental self preservation for a year. I finally faced it, and am feeling so WELL now. I hope I can help others here who may face a similar crisis!

ARI

Well!!!!

May I be whipped unto submission!!!! I stand totally corrected, Chatty, and am more than happy to admit it! May the Gods of mercy stand beside you and give you the strength of many! So now, I will have to think again....and yet again...ARi, such a wonderful example you are - I am hoping that you , indeed, can influence others who are having the same difficulties and bring them to the same conclusions that Chatty has so obviously brought to your attention!!!! I am seriously laughing at all this at the present time - who woulda' thought? What a hoot this all is!!!!! Well, I shouldn't say that , as I know it has been very serious, still----we need to find humor wherever we can- LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL. On me.

Searcher

Searcher in this my last post tonight before I go eat something so my stomach doesn't think my throat has been cut, we are FRIENDS. Have you been reading all the other threads today? I have and we have been chatting very amicably in all those. I rarely ever allow mself anger and rarely feel any. Now this is for you as well Ari, I truly care about this Forum and pretty much all the women coming here. I try to make everyone feel welcome and I bring back posts so no women feels ignored or passed over. I have a high number of posts because I read these posts word for word then muddle them over in my mind before answering as helpfully as possible. Ari what you felt from me seemed harsh and for that I apologize but you seemed to need someone to put their arms around you and shake some sense into you that you were and are too good for someone like that guy. I am on your side. I unlike some others here NEVER call names or insult or degrade another woman. I am all for women, all the time. I was nearly destroyed by a man that I loved and trusted totally. Others knew about him and never told me for fear of hurting me, they were cowards and didn't want to be the preceived bad guys. I wish they had told me. Anyway I am sorry if my somewhat gruff truths are not what some want to hear even though they need to hear it. Ari talk about it taking a long time to heal from a broken yet short romance. I know of what you speak as I am still in mourning from the death of my husband of five years in the 1960's. He was my one true love....I guess time does not necessarily heal all wounds. I will be even more cautious with my replys to everyone hoping to be helpful, not hurtful....Thank you both for your honesty and may I ask one favor? When reading a post or the answer to a post, read it several times and read it well to be sure you get the true meaning of what is being said...

[ February 21, 2006, 12:29 AM: Message edited by: chatty lady ]

Of course, Chatty, let's all go to bed. With dreams comforting, and with surity that tomorrow, we will wake,knowing that we all are here to support one another.

quote:

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Originally posted by smilinize:


Chatty is the dear Abby of this site.

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